# Issues with Ford 5610. Please help.



## gearhead2069 (Oct 3, 2018)

Hey guys, new to the forum here and looking for some insight into an issue I've been struggling with. 

My wife and I recently purchased a 1984 Ford 5610 (diesel with CAV pump and single filter setup) from her grandfathers estate. He purchased the tractor brand new back in the day and it has been his work tractor ever since. When I picked it up and gave it a HEAVY look over and found that he had basically "fixed" little things throughout the years just to keep it running. Not a big deal if it is just one thing here and there but after over 30 years of that... there was a lot of refreshing to do. In this conquest, among other things, I pulled the head off just to make sure the cylinder walls were good. No scoring. All the gaskets were changed and compression is great. Tank had been completely removed and flushed. A new stop cock was placed with new screen filter. Fuel filter is new. Upon putting the tractor back together, I did my best to reuse old parts where I could. Initially after priming the lines the tractor started and ran well. No surging, no idle issues. After running it for a while the tractor would stop running. I then had to re-prime the lines and it fired up once again. Being relatively new to old tractors, I figured I didn't prime well initially and just hit an air pocket or something. Well, The next time I started the tractor, I ran it around for about 30 minutes, once again no issues, to have it die again. No surging, just stopped running as if it was out of fuel. This go around, priming did nothing. I pulled the fuel lines back off and realized that the output from the fuel lines at the injectors was barely a drip even though the fuel supply line to the pump poured. I pulled the pump off again and disassembled the thing hoping that resealing it would fix my issues... well it didn't. 1500 dollars for a new CAV pump later and I re-prime the lines and the tractor fires right up again. While re-priming, I noted that I had a good little shot of fuel coming out of the lines at the injectors which wasn't there before with the old pump so I was pretty optimistic that the issue had been fixed. Well, as I had the tractor idling, recharging the battery and bleeding the hydraulic lines and steering pump (about 30 minutes at idle), the tractor dies again. Once again, no surging, just stops. I re-bleed the lines and the tractor starts right back up again. 

I'm at a loss here guys. It has good compression, a new stop-cock, a new fuel filter, new return lines with fittings (the one that links all the top of the injectors together and goes into the top of the pump on one end and to the fuel tank on the other), a new fuel pump, runs after a bleed, but then kills over after running for at least 15 minutes and no more than 30 minutes. I have no fuel leaks while the engine is running. The only thing I haven't replaced is the two other lines that supplies fuel from the filter and returns the fuel from the end of the pump back to the filter. I was thinking that maybe those lines had a leak as they do feel a bit rough to the touch but there is never any fuel dripping from them. 

I don't have a problem replacing those lines as well, I just want to ensure that this is the problem before I drop another 150 dollars and waste a week worth of shipping and lost time just to have the issue not resolved. If you all could give me any other ideas of what is going on, I can order the parts and have everything shipped and replaced all at once. I figured I'd seek knowledge superior to my own before placing an order. If any of you have had this issue or are aware of what I have going on, some help would be much appreciated. 

Thank you guys. I look forward to any response.


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## thepumpguysc (Jan 25, 2015)

DAAAAM.. u wasted a lot of money.!!! for a problem u caused.. Lol
When u changed the filter.. u put the big oring "ON" the filter didn't u??
What happens is> u choke off the supply..
The oring GOES "UP IN" THE FILTER HEAD.. NOT "ON" THE FILTER.. it seals on the lip of the filter..
Just take it back down & look & reposition the big oring.. Good luck..
BTW> I would have rebuilt that pump for 475..


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## gearhead2069 (Oct 3, 2018)

thepumpguysc said:


> DAAAAM.. u wasted a lot of money.!!! for a problem u caused.. Lol
> When u changed the filter.. u put the big oring "ON" the filter didn't u??
> What happens is> u choke off the supply..
> The oring GOES "UP IN" THE FILTER HEAD.. NOT "ON" THE FILTER.. it seals on the lip of the filter..
> ...


Thanks for the response. 

Man do I wish that would have been my mistake and so simple to fix. I replaced the o-rings exactly as it instructs on the side of the can. 










I’m not an expert by any means, but it seems that I don’t have an issue with supply to the pump. I can disconnect the supply lines and the fuel pours out. Further more, when I have to re-bleed, I only have to re-bleed directly at the injectors. I loosen those lines up and crank it over and I can see little bubbles mixed with fuel coming out around the threads. If I had a supply issue, I would expect that it wouldn’t even be delivering fuel at all. 

I could be completely wrong about that and I am more than open to correction. Regarding the o-rigs around the filters, they were installed correctly.


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## RC Wells (Dec 26, 2008)

Bubbles equal air infiltration. 

If you are certain the filter is properly installed, go back to the fuel valve on the tank and be sure the two O rings are in good shape. One on the valve cock, and one on the line to valve connector. A large percentage of the replacement fuel tank valves are from China and defective right out of the box.

If those are good, check the diaphragm fuel pump called the fuel pump primer assembly for air infiltration, and if you have the auxiliary fuel tank check all tubes, fittings and the electric fuel pump.

Then, the other shoe! There have been a number of new "CAV" injection pumps sourced from China that are defective. Far better to rebuild.


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## gearhead2069 (Oct 3, 2018)

RC Wells said:


> Bubbles equal air infiltration.
> 
> If you are certain the filter is properly installed, go back to the fuel valve on the tank and be sure the two O rings are in good shape. One on the valve cock, and one on the line to valve connector. A large percentage of the replacement fuel tank valves are from China and defective right out of the box.
> 
> ...


I sourced all of my parts from a local New Holland dealer so I would definitely hope that none of the parts are from China unless that’s where New Holland is sourcing their stock. 

My tractor actually doesn’t have a hand primer. There is a port that is capped off coming off the filter (you should be able to see it in the picture in the previous post) and from the diagrams on the New Holland site, it appears that is where one is supposed to go. Do you think I should order one and install it on my tractor? 

The only things in the fuel system I haven’t replaced at this point are the two nylon fuel lines that go from the filter body into the CAV pump. Even though there is no fuel leaking from them, do you think that could be the issue but is only sucking air when the tractor is running? 


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## thepumpguysc (Jan 25, 2015)

IF your 100% sure about the oring.. I'd still check it..
IS that a NAPA filter?? cuz that's what the service bulletin isabout.. NAPA filters.
How about the "olives" on the end of the lines?? new? its the little black rubber pieces that fit up in the filter head or on the line.. they'll get hard & suck air.


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## thepumpguysc (Jan 25, 2015)

Are u talking about that screw that is barely visable in the pic?? That's your air bleed screw. I've NEVER seen a hand primer on that filter head..


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## gearhead2069 (Oct 3, 2018)

thepumpguysc said:


> IF your 100% sure about the oring.. I'd still check it..
> IS that a NAPA filter?? cuz that's what the service bulletin isabout.. NAPA filters.
> How about the "olives" on the end of the lines?? new? its the little black rubber pieces that fit up in the filter head or on the line.. they'll get hard & suck air.


Yeah, I went out and pulled it off when I took the picture just to make sure. 

I did get the filter from NAPA. I guess I didn’t get the memo about the service bulletin on those. 

The three o-rings inside the filter housing are brand new (two big ones and a small one). The little black rings on the line fittings that screw into the filter housing are the old reused ones. Are you all thinking that could be contributing? 


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## thepumpguysc (Jan 25, 2015)

99% of those exact symptoms are corrected by repositioning that filter head oring..


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## gearhead2069 (Oct 3, 2018)

thepumpguysc said:


> 99% of those exact symptoms are corrected by repositioning that filter head oring..


Yeah, I pulled it off and made sure it was as you said. 


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## thepumpguysc (Jan 25, 2015)

Does yours have orings on the end of the lines or the black "tube looking" things??
They're about the size of a cig. butt,


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## thepumpguysc (Jan 25, 2015)

Pull the line off the filter head that goes to the inj. pump & snap/post a pic.


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## gearhead2069 (Oct 3, 2018)

thepumpguysc said:


> Does yours have orings on the end of the lines or the black "tube looking" things??
> They're about the size of a cig. butt,














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## thepumpguysc (Jan 25, 2015)

If I'm not mistaken, it takes the thin olives.. inside the hole that the line screws into??
Look inside the hole.. both the inlet & the return on the side of the pump.. see if there is a rubber.. probably have to use a scribe to poke it..
Your NEW inj. pump should have come w/ them.. both the thick & the thin olives??


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## gearhead2069 (Oct 3, 2018)

thepumpguysc said:


> If I'm not mistaken, it takes the thin olives.. inside the hole that the line screws into??
> Look inside the hole.. both the inlet & the return on the side of the pump.. see if there is a rubber.. probably have to use a scribe to poke it..
> Your NEW inj. pump should have come w/ them.. both the thick & the thin olives??


Well... I guess New Holland didn’t find it appropriate to supply me with those. I contacted my dealer and I’ll be picking them up come this weekend. Also, apparently New Holland no longer supplies those nylon fuel lines anymore so I’ll be taking those off and having them replicated at a local hydraulic shop just to be safe. They are feeling pretty brittle so if they aren’t leaking now, I’m sure they will be soon enough. Might as well take this frustration to its fullest instead of dealing with a separate frustration later. 

Thank you guys for giving me a direction to run in. I’ll be sure to give you all an update on the outcome. If you all think of any other possibilities between now and then, just throw me a line. 

Thanks again. 


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## RC Wells (Dec 26, 2008)

"The three o-rings inside the filter housing are brand new (two big ones and a small one). The little black rings on the line fittings that screw into the filter housing are the old reused ones. Are you all thinking that could be contributing? "

Use no old seals, replace them all. Once they have been in place for years, then the lines loosened, they will draw air.


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## gearhead2069 (Oct 3, 2018)

thepumpguysc said:


> IF your 100% sure about the oring.. I'd still check it..
> IS that a NAPA filter?? cuz that's what the service bulletin isabout.. NAPA filters.
> How about the "olives" on the end of the lines?? new? its the little black rubber pieces that fit up in the filter head or on the line.. they'll get hard & suck air.


Yeah, I pulled the filter off and checked the o-ring right before sending a picture of the filter. 

No, the black rubber pieces are old. I’m having those sourced at my dealer.

I would assume as I did pick it up from NAPA. I’ve been searching for a service bulletin regarding the NAPA filters and I’m coming up short. If you don’t mind, can you fill me in? If I need to, I’ll grab a new one from my New Holland dealer this weekend. 




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## thepumpguysc (Jan 25, 2015)

I have the bulletin on my computer but don't know how to post it to this site..
YES, I would pick up a NH filter.. theres a HUGE diff.. Have a look at the fuel inlet portion of the Napa, compared to the Ford.. & the oring placement.. & you'll SEE what I'm talking about.


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## gearhead2069 (Oct 3, 2018)

Well, we’re up and running for now. Used the tractor quite a bit yesterday and no issues. I replaced the nylon fuel lines and bought a OEM filter. Yeah, no kidding, there is a huge difference between the OEM and Napa filters. When looking at the difference between the two, I have no idea how the NAPA could even work in comparison. I bought a bunch of those olives. When I got home and looked inside the fittings, I have absolutely no place for those things to go. Every one of my connections have a cone where a brass ferrule fits in and compresses. The olives didn’t even fit in the hole. I replaced the ferrules (new lines) and pressed them in with the fitting. They formed to the steel taper and made a good seal. 

I don’t know, after taking the old lines off, they looked pretty brittle. Swapping those out in combination with changing out to the OEM filter seems to have done the trick. 

So anyway, ran the tractor all day yesterday and I’ve had no issues. I appreciate all the help guys. If anything comes up, I’ll be sure to let you know. 


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## thepumpguysc (Jan 25, 2015)

It old ya so..
That's why the oring HAS TO go UP IN the filter head or it cuts off the fuel. 
Congrats on listening & getting it running..


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## 3 point (Sep 20, 2017)

Have you checked in side the tank for debris, I had a similar situation in my 3600 and that was the cause. Just for for fun ck it out.

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## gearhead2069 (Oct 3, 2018)

3 point said:


> Have you checked in side the tank for debris, I had a similar situation in my 3600 and that was the cause. Just for for fun ck it out.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930V using Tractor Forum mobile app


Yeah, the tank got cleaned out. I suppose my issues were remedied after replacing the fuel supply lines and using an OEM fuel filter rather than one of the NAPA ones. Tractor has been purring ever since and Ive had no issues with it absorbing the abuse I’ve been dishing out since then. 


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## 3 point (Sep 20, 2017)

glad to hear.

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## thepumpguysc (Jan 25, 2015)

I don't know what u paid for the filter at NH but the actual P# for the OEM filter {CAV} is 7111-296 its only 5.00 & change on the web.. U autta stock up OR keep that P# handy..
Glad she's up & runnin.. Happy Tractoring.. TPG


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