# Problems with MF 231 hydraulic valve selector



## kenneth Izah (Dec 29, 2019)

Hi , Please I am having problems alternating between my front loader 2346QT bush hog and my rotary cutter Titan 1400 series on my MF 231 tractor, I do not know how to position the Draft control to use the lift , or the position control.
I cannot operate the loader even when I switch the valve selector to return. I know they cannot both work at the same time.


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## Fedup (Feb 25, 2014)

First off there's no "one size fits all" solution to your problem. 200 series Massey's could be configured in multiple configurations, and we still don't know exactly what you have. I'm "assuming" here there are no factory type auxiliary valves/couplers connected by steel tubing plumbed in and out of the side cover containing the PTO on/off lever? You mentioned a selector valve but there are several of those out there as well. Is that mounted on the right front corner of the lift housing? Does it have a plunger that slides in and out or a single lever that rotates a spool through two or three different positions? On the three point controls - does the position control scale have a spot labeled "constant pumping"?


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## kenneth Izah (Dec 29, 2019)

Fedup said:


> First off there's no "one size fits all" solution to your problem. 200 series Massey's could be configured in multiple configurations, and we still don't know exactly what you have. I'm "assuming" here there are no factory type auxiliary valves/couplers connected by steel tubing plumbed in and out of the side cover containing the PTO on/off lever? You mentioned a selector valve but there are several of those out there as well. Is that mounted on the right front corner of the lift housing? Does it have a plunger that slides in and out or a single lever that rotates a spool through two or three different positions? On the three point controls - does the position control scale have a spot labeled "constant pumping"?












Hi, Thanks for your response. This what the selector looks like , it is located under the operator sit. If you turn the lever to the left, it selects the lift arm and the other way to return is for the loader I suppose.
Yes , the position control has "Constant Pumping".


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## Fedup (Feb 25, 2014)

If you read through the posts on the other threads you replied to you will see much of that applies to you as well. The selector sends oil flow to the lift system in one position and to externals in the other position. When the external position is selected, with the draft lever up and position control in constant pumping the oil flow should be directed to the loader valve (provided said external port is properly connected to the "in" port on the loader valve and the "out" port has a path for oil return to tractor sump). At this point the three point will not operate, but may hold at whatever position it's in, depending on internal leakage.


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## kenneth Izah (Dec 29, 2019)

Hi Fedup,
Thanks, will check this out.


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## Busted Tractor (May 22, 2018)

Most of the small Masseys use the old scotch yoke pump for the hydraulic system. The pump designed by Harry Ferguson is controlled by controlling the intake of the pump. This works just fine when a three point implement is used but can be confusing when you want to use the system for other things. There are a few things to remember. They are DRAFT is used for ground engaging implements. It has very poor position control it is either up or down. It is very sensitive when using a ground engaging implement. Do NOT use draft to attach or unhook an implement. POSITION controls the three point hitch relative to where and how far you move the position control lever. It will hold an implement to the position you set it to. CONSTANT PUMPING This is never used with the three point hitch. When you want to use the pump for a constant flow for a loader, log splitter, etc. you need to set the valve under the seat to the non three point position and set the lever to the constant pump position. If you forget to move the lever out of constant pump and are not using pump flow, you may think the transmission is destroying itself but it is the relief valve blowing it also also loads the engine. Some of the masseys used the position control lever for feature called Pressure Control. Don't think this is on your tractor. It is a feature that required a special hitch and worked as a weight transfer system. If I have not explained good enough leave me know I will try to do better.


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## MF231/232 (Mar 9, 2021)

Busted Tractor said:


> Most of the small Masseys use the old scotch yoke pump for the hydraulic system. The pump designed by Harry Ferguson is controlled by controlling the intake of the pump. This works just fine when a three point implement is used but can be confusing when you want to use the system for other things. There are a few things to remember. They are DRAFT is used for ground engaging implements. It has very poor position control it is either up or down. It is very sensitive when using a ground engaging implement. Do NOT use draft to attach or unhook an implement. POSITION controls the three point hitch relative to where and how far you move the position control lever. It will hold an implement to the position you set it to. CONSTANT PUMPING This is never used with the three point hitch. When you want to use the pump for a constant flow for a loader, log splitter, etc. you need to set the valve under the seat to the non three point position and set the lever to the constant pump position. If you forget to move the lever out of constant pump and are not using pump flow, you may think the transmission is destroying itself but it is the relief valve blowing it also also loads the engine. Some of the masseys used the position control lever for feature called Pressure Control. Don't think this is on your tractor. It is a feature that required a special hitch and worked as a weight transfer system. If I have not explained good enough leave me know I will try to do better.


Busted- new here and new to my 231 with a 232 loader. Just to confirm when using the FEL, I need to be in constant pumping with the three point in the raised position? And the only time to use the constant pumping with a three point attachment would be when I had something like a log splitter hooked up to the hydraulics (wouldn’t use constant with box blade for example).
Thank you in advance.


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## Busted Tractor (May 22, 2018)

See if I can explain a little better. When using the three point hitch is the only time you cannot use constant pumping. The three point hitch then controls the input to the pump. Once position is satisfied by where the lever is set it stops pumping and the hitch stays at that position. Once the valve is set in the other position the pump can then be set at constant pumping. Constant pumping then becomes an open center system where oil must flow to do work or return to the transmission, such as a valve on the loader or log splitter. Most "modern" loaders having double acting lift and hydraulic dump buckets use a valve mounted on the right upright of the loader or on the tractor, so that is when constant pumping would be used. Some of the "older" loaders having single acting lift and a trip bucket could use the lever beside the seat to raise and lower them but that is another issue. With the valve you have on the tractor it does not need to have the hitch fully raised to operate the other outlet (to the other valve) it should stay at the position it was when you changed the valve selector. When you change the valve for loader or other work and put it in constant pumping the linkage overrides the draft and position linkage and sets the pump to pump constantly. Having the levers in constant pumping and set to operate the three point will remind you to move the lever out of constant pumping quickly, it loads the engine and blows the relief valve and usually makes a racket like the transmission is about to fly out of the case. But will cause no damage unless you leave the lever set in constant pumping for a long time.

Hope this helps, if not leave me know and I'll try again.
Have a wonderful day


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## MF231/232 (Mar 9, 2021)

Thank you for the reply. I’ve only owned this tractor for about 6 months, has a little less than 400 hours. Minus a few minor Leaks on the FEL, it worked great. Got on the tractor the past two weekends and everything started out great but after about 15-20 minutes of operating, the loader quit working(ie would only lower). Put it in the barn, and tried again this past weekend with same result.

i did notice that the lever to switch from FEL to 3pt moves a lot easier than before. The fluid is full. Any thoughts to what could be happening?


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## Busted Tractor (May 22, 2018)

A few things come to mind. There is a filter on the pump inlet that could be restricting the oil flow, I believe the filter is accessible under the just behind the transmission "joint", a three bolt triangular shaped cover. The bad is the rear must be drained. Are there any quick couplers in the lines to the loader valve? if the fail they can act as a check valve stopping oil flow. I should have asked first will the three point hitch work when the loader doesn't? That would eliminate the pump and stand pipe. When it quits and you say only lowers does it have down pressure and does the bucket work? Is the oil white colored as having water in it? As for the valve moving easier There should only be o ring to seal the end of the shaft nothing internal. If it was new it may have been stiff and as it is used would get slightly easier to use. Now the bad-bad if the hitch won't pick up a load and any other functions won't work the pump may need new rings and possibly chambers but at 400 hrs don't think that's an issue. Of course there is always the possibility of a valve cracked internally but that is rare. Now the big question are you sure it was in constant pumping--remember if the hitch is up and you are not in constant pumping the position control will shut off the pump. By the way I see that tractor is equipped with pressure control ( the front part of the position control quadrant. That is a weight transfer system that uses a variable relief valve and a special hitch on the three point. It is supposed to increase traction by taking weight of the front of the tractor and off the implement. If it is out of adjustment or leaks internally it can cause issues but not very likely. 

Hope that makes sense and get the issue gone.
Have a wonderful day


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## MF231/232 (Mar 9, 2021)

Forgot to mention that the 3 pt raises and lowers as it should even when the loader will not. Been looking to see if there is a separate filter or reservoir for the FEL.


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## MF231/232 (Mar 9, 2021)

I posted before I saw your response. I’ll take a peak at the tractor again before replying again. I really appreciate the advise.


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## Busted Tractor (May 22, 2018)

By using the internal tractor pump which uses the oil from the transmission/rear end housings there is no other reservoir for the loader and the filter is inside the housing and only filters the oil before it enters the pump. If you had a front mounted or PTO mounted pump then a separate reservoir, plumbing, filter, etc would be required and you would not need the valve on the cover. After looking at the pictures you have posted I am wondering if you are putting the draft lever fully up and the position control lever in the blue constant pumping position. Because if the hitch works that indicates the pump is functioning so it is probably a "control" issue. Remember unless you are in constant pumping the position control will override the pump control and shut it off so if the hitch rises the pump will stop pumping unless it is set to constant pumping. 
Harry Ferguson was a pretty smart fellow when he designed the Ferguson system which uses the inlet side of the pump to control the hitch but to get a constant flow for auxiliary use can be very frustrating and very confusing. It took me a few years to understand how it operates and then there are a few different control types used from the original design to the latest designs. Sometimes it was very frustrating to explain to some how and why it worked the way it does. But once the basics are understood it almost becomes simple. 

Have a wonderful day


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## MF231/232 (Mar 9, 2021)

Busted Tractor said:


> By using the internal tractor pump which uses the oil from the transmission/rear end housings there is no other reservoir for the loader and the filter is inside the housing and only filters the oil before it enters the pump. If you had a front mounted or PTO mounted pump then a separate reservoir, plumbing, filter, etc would be required and you would not need the valve on the cover. After looking at the pictures you have posted I am wondering if you are putting the draft lever fully up and the position control lever in the blue constant pumping position. Because if the hitch works that indicates the pump is functioning so it is probably a "control" issue. Remember unless you are in constant pumping the position control will override the pump control and shut it off so if the hitch rises the pump will stop pumping unless it is set to constant pumping.
> Harry Ferguson was a pretty smart fellow when he designed the Ferguson system which uses the inlet side of the pump to control the hitch but to get a constant flow for auxiliary use can be very frustrating and very confusing. It took me a few years to understand how it operates and then there are a few different control types used from the original design to the latest designs. Sometimes it was very frustrating to explain to some how and why it worked the way it does. But once the basics are understood it almost becomes simple.
> 
> Have a wonderful day


Busted,
With your explanation (and i purchased/read the manuals), it appears that everything is working as is. Used the tractor some this weekend and all seems to be working as intended.
Thanks again!


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