# Help me buy a new tractor



## zxracer3

My grandpa is looking to buy a new tractor and is not sure which one to buy. I know nothing about tractors but he does not know how to use the internet and I told him that I would go to a forum (I am into cars know how helpful they are). He’s had several older tractors but has never bought a new one before and wants to get the best for his $$. He would just ask the people at the dealership but they keep giving him all different answers, so I am asking you for your help. He will mainly use it for brush hogging so a 3 pt. hitch is mandatory. There are a lot of hills (he has around 300 acres) so he is looking for one that has around 50-55 hp. His price range is around $25,000-$30,000. He plans on having the tractor for the rest of his life so it has to be reliable. As far as brands are concerned he likes New Holland and John Deer, but if there is a better brand so be it. He will not purchase a Kubota since he was in the war and has a strong disliking towards anything Japanese made. He would like a tractor with a bucket, but he is afraid to do so, because the ones that he has looked at appear to have smaller rim and tires, making the front end appearing to be narrower, and with the hills he is worried. 

So here are my questions:

1) He has looked at the New Holland TC55DA and the TC48DA and likes them both. My only concern is the reliability of the TC55DA being that it is turbocharged. What is your opinion about the two, and which one is better out of them? I know the TC55DA has more hp (55 in comparison to 48) but is it worth it because of the reliability of the turbocharger? Like I said, he plans on keeping this thing forever. 

2) With the TC55DA and the TC48DA he noticed that the one with the bucket had smaller tires and wheels, resulting in a narrower front end. The one without the bucket appeared to be more stable. He really wants a bucket on the front, but is afraid that with the hills, he will run into trouble. Should he just get the one without the bucket? 

3) If not the TC55DA or the TC48DA which one should he buy? He likes both of them, but also likes John Deer. He needs the one he buys to be about the size of the TC55DA or TC48DA because he wants to keep it in his garage. 

Thank You for all of your help, he and I greatly appreciate it!


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## Morgan

Welcome to the TractorForum were glad you found us.



If it were me I would go with the TC55DA out of the two and make sure to get the one with FWA (Front Wheel Assist) that will help with the loader and with the hills. The turbo charger wouldnt bother me any as they have come a long way with those lasting.


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## Live Oak

Let me add my welcome to Tractor Forum as well zx. 

Did your grandpa have a particular preference for a particular transmission? This is an important area to consider. I agree that 4WD would be a must. 

My thinking is that your grandpa will be needing an agriculture class tractor and the compact and super compacts such as the TC55DA or TC48DA are compact tractors in the top of the compact tractor class. They are just not built like an ag tractor. Perhaps the TNA-60 or 70 would be more in line with the intended applications as far as New Holland. 

As far as John Deere, the 5225, or 5205 would be good choices.

Another brand that gives great value for the dollar is Kioti. A Kioti DK65 or 55 would be in line as well.


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## DK35vince

> _Originally posted by zxracer3 _
> * I know the TC55DA has more hp (55 in comparison to 48) but is it worth it because of the reliability of the turbocharger? Like I said, he plans on keeping this thing forever. *


* 

Turbo charged diesels are very reliable.
I've worked around and/or operated turbo diesel powered equipment and trucks for the last 20 years or more. Very rare to see a turbo problem.*


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## zxracer3

I appreciate all of your help. You guys have given us some great information. He definitely wants a 4WD. I like chief's idea of the larger tractors. They do look more capable. The only thing is that he wants to store it in his garage and I think that they may be too big. I just tried to call him to find out the dimensions of where he will be keeping it, and sure enough he was outside playing with his old tractor. I'll let you guys know when I find out. 

Since you guys said that the turbo version is reliable he may go with that one. He really liked that one when he went to go look at it. 

What is your opinions on the TC55DA with the bucket vs. without the bucket?

Are there any John Deere's that are in the "same class" as the TC55DA, that are better then the New holland? He likes them also but has not looked at them since he likes the New holland so much. I just want to make sure that he gets the best tractor for his $. 

Once again thank you for helping us out so we don't make a big mistake!!

Hey Chief, I like your dog quote in your signature! How true is that.


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## Morgan

John Deere is a very good reliable tractor but is going to cost alot more than the NH


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## Live Oak

I believe John Deere's comparable model to the New Holland TC55DA is their 4720.


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## zxracer3

If it were up to you guys would you go with the TC55DA or the 4720. Which one do you think is a better tractor/buy?


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## Live Oak

If you are going with a non-cab tractor; I think you will run into the same problem with garage storage with either unless you fold down the ROPS. The John Deere 5025 and 5205 both come with a fold down ROPS and they both should fit in the garage if the others will. I am not real big on the John Deere 4000 series tractor primarily due to their transmission and final drive axle housings being constructed of cast aluminum. Not the strongest material in the world and it does not add BADLY needed ballast weight to the tractor. I am not real happy with the quality and workmanship of the New Holland tractors. They have had issues with peeling paint, electrical problems, and some other issues. If it were me; I would be considering the 5025, 5205, or Kioti DK65 or 55.


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## zxracer3

Alright I just talked to my grandfather and I talked him into the larger agricultural tractors as recommended by chief. He has a barn that he is going to empty into the garage to make room for the tractor. 

I am bothering you guys again to ask you which one you like better between the 5025, 5205 or Kioti DK65 or 55. Is the John deere better over the Kioti. If you had to pick a model which one would you go with.


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## Live Oak

I guess the deciding factor in this case in my opinion would be what type of transmission does your grandfather want? Will he be happy with a standard shift sync reverse or want the power reverser. The shift transmission with the power reverser option is the most useful and practical in my opinion. It does come with added cost though. For box blading and FEL work, the power reverser really does improve efficiency and ease of application. The 5205 nor does the Kioti DK65 or 55 offer the power reverser transmission. In that case the 5025 would be the choice to go with. If the power reverser option is not wanted, the 5205 and the DK65 are both real good choices.


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## zxracer3

Thankyou very much Chief the information that you gave me is just what I am looking for. 

What is your opinion about the bucket. My grandfather really would like the bucket on the front, but is afraid that the front end that comes with the bucket is too narrow to brushhog with, as opposed to the one without the bucket. Should he get the one with or without the bucket.


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## Live Oak

If by bucket you mean FEL (front end loader), by all means yes; I would absolutely get the front end loader and the 4WD option. The front axle on a 4WD tractor is very beefy on these tractors and the tires are typically not as big as the rear tires but not far from it. Front end stability should not be a problem provided the tractor is properly used and ballasted within its recommended limits. I have the 430 FEL on my 4410 and bush hog with it a LOT. The FEL actually offsets the added weight of the bush hog very well. I would recommend getting the heavy duty bucket unless your grandfather will only be using it occasionally for light use. I would also recommend going with the R-1 ag tires unless there will be some cross over use on turf. You will have to decide how you want to ballast the tractor once the FEL is installed. Typically, the cheapest method is filling the rear tires but this does have drawbacks in the event of a flat rear tire. Wheel weights typically run about $1.75 a lb. installed now adays. You will need a combination of filled tires and wheel weights or wheel weights and a rear ballast box or heavy impliment mounted on the rear hitch. As far as the rest of the options; you will have to run through them and decide what you want.


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## zxracer3

> _Originally posted by Chief _
> *If by bucket you mean FEL (front end loader), by all means yes; I would absolutely get the front end loader and the 4WD option. The front axle on a 4WD tractor is very beefy on these tractors and the tires are typically not as big as the rear tires but not far from it. Front end stability should not be a problem provided the tractor is properly used and ballasted within its recommended limits. I have the 430 FEL on my 4410 and bush hog with it a LOT. The FEL actually offsets the added weight of the bush hog very well. I would recommend getting the heavy duty bucket unless your grandfather will only be using it occasionally for light use. I would also recommend going with the R-1 ag tires unless there will be some cross over use on turf. You will have to decide how you want to ballast the tractor once the FEL is installed. Typically, the cheapest method is filling the rear tires but this does have drawbacks in the event of a flat rear tire. Wheel weights typically run about $1.75 a lb. installed now adays. You will need a combination of filled tires and wheel weights or wheel weights and a rear ballast box or heavy impliment mounted on the rear hitch. As far as the rest of the options; you will have to run through them and decide what you want. *



Both my grandfather and I have noticed that the FEL has a narrower front end, possibly to clear the FEL. It seems as if the tire and rim combination is smaller on the FEL tractors then the non-FEL. He was worried that the tractor with the FEL would be less stable then the non-FEL. He was worried by the side to side stability rather then the front to back stability. Does this chage anyhting from what you just said?


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## Live Oak

Lateral or side to side stability is largely determined by the width of the rear tires and how low the center of gravity weight is configured on the tractor. FEL's can drastically change this if loads of any considerable weight are moved or carried raised up high. The axles on the 4WD tractors are the same width regardless of whether the FEL is installed or not. The tire combinations are the same for the most part regardless of whether the FEL is installed. Yes, there are a variety of tire options to select from but there are no tire that are particular for use with a FEL. The front end does not contribute much to stablility in the lateral axis as it is mounted on a free floating pivot. Typically the R-1 ag tires and rims offer the widest variety of rear wheel width adjustment options. Installing a FEL on your tractor will not change anything except that now more weight mounted higher up on the tractor's center of gravity. This is true with most any tractor. Properly installed and ballasted; you should not have any problems. In applications where the tractor will be operating on very steep slopes; remove the FEL. Most are able to be removed and installed in less than 5 minutes; also be mindful to take on the slope in a purpendicular angle with the tractor whenever possible.


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## zxracer3

Thank You very much chief thats just what I wanted to hear, you were very insightful. He is going to the John Deere dealership over the next couple of days so I will post the results.


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## Simpleprestige

Here are some reviews on the 4320 and many other models. It says it fits in a standard garage with the FEL.

http://www.compacttractorreview.com/review-John-Deere-4320_1478.aspx


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## zxracer3

Alright my grandfather went to both the Kioti and John Deere dealerships. The John Deere dealership claimed that the 5025 and 5205 were older models and were no longer available to be purchased new. The Kioti dealership claimed that they never ordered any of the DK65’s. Any Ideas? He was kind of lost when he went to the dealership and they did not have any of the tractor’s that I had told him to look at. At the Kioti dealership the salesman showed him the DK45SE HST and he did kind of fall in love with it. Is the DK45SE HST any good or should he look into different models? 

Thank You again guys for all of your help!


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## Live Oak

The DK-45 is a good tractor if that will do the tasks he wants. 

The John Deere salesman does not know what he is talking about and I would ask for another salesman or the manager.

John Deere 5025 Series

Even if what the salesmans says is true; he should be able to show you the current models that replaced the 5025 Series and the 5205.


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## zxracer3

> _Originally posted by Chief _
> *The DK-45 is a good tractor if that will do the tasks he wants.
> 
> The John Deere salesman does not know what he is talking about and I would ask for another salesman or the manager.
> 
> John Deere 5025 Series
> 
> Even if what the salesmans says is true; he should be able to show you the current models that replaced the 5025 Series and the 5205. *


I totally agree Chief. My grandfather is a real push over so I have no Idea what went on between the 2 of them. I live 250 miles away so there is not much I can do about it. Now that you said this it upsets me even more. I am going to talk to him about it tomorrow and maybe call the dealership myself to see what is going on. 

Thank you chief for coming through once again. If it weren't for you he would have ended up with an oversized lawn mower by the time he was done.


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## Live Oak

Ultimately it is your grandfather who is the one who is going to have to be satisfied with the machine in the end. He should go demo the DK45 and even the DK55 if they have one at the dealer. Depending upon what his plans are for the tractor, sometimes less is more. So far I am doing fine with my 35 hp 4410. I make do in some applications but it gets the job done. Having a small tractor make it a LOT easier to get into tough spot bush hogging.


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## HYDROGUARDIAN16

case DX55


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## zxracer3

How are the case tractors? Would you guys reccomend them over the kioti? So far he really likes the kioti.


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## Live Oak

Case is more or less a rebadged and repainted New Holland.


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## zxracer3

> _Originally posted by Chief _
> *Case is more or less a rebadged and repainted New Holland. *


Thats all I need to know. 

I think he is set on the Kioti. He is still looking around though as he has never bought anything new before and wants to make sure he's 100% satisfied.


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## Simpleprestige

I have probably shared this story 3 or four times, but I just don't want to let anyone get into the same trap as us.

A neighbor of ours bought a brand new Kioti something or other with a loader and backhoe cobination. IT only had ten hours on it. He went away for a while and asked if he could store it in our barn. We were told we could use it all we wanted for our landscaping projects. The first day we used it, a hydraulic line burst while trying to lift a rock. We know it wasn't too heavy, because we had to lift it by hand into a wheelbarrow and push it across the lawn. We left the tractor outside so we wouldn't get fluid all over, and the dealer came out and repaired the mess. THe next weekend we went to do some more work. Tried to lift a bucketload of dirt. couldn't do it, it was just too strenuous. Back to the wheelbarrow. We left it in the barn that night, came out on sunday, and the floor was covered in three or four different types of fluids, needless to say, it didn't stay inside anymore.


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## DK35vince

No problems with my Kioti.
I have 1000 hours on my Kioti DK 35. It has been problem free.
It has never failed to start, never blown a line, never had an oil leak.
I have replaced 2 parts, a tachometer cable ($8) and a plastic fuel filter bowl ($9).


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## zxracer3

> _Originally posted by Simpleprestige _
> *I have probably shared this story 3 or four times, but I just don't want to let anyone get into the same trap as us.
> 
> A neighbor of ours bought a brand new Kioti something or other with a loader and backhoe cobination. IT only had ten hours on it. He went away for a while and asked if he could store it in our barn. We were told we could use it all we wanted for our landscaping projects. The first day we used it, a hydraulic line burst while trying to lift a rock. We know it wasn't too heavy, because we had to lift it by hand into a wheelbarrow and push it across the lawn. We left the tractor outside so we wouldn't get fluid all over, and the dealer came out and repaired the mess. THe next weekend we went to do some more work. Tried to lift a bucketload of dirt. couldn't do it, it was just too strenuous. Back to the wheelbarrow. We left it in the barn that night, came out on sunday, and the floor was covered in three or four different types of fluids, needless to say, it didn't stay inside anymore. *


Oh wow. That can't be good. Maybe it was a lemon. I have heard so many good things about them so far. Anyone else with similar problems?


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## Lamar Holland

regardless of brand, including the big three, there will always be a lemon somewhere in the lineup.. If I was looking at Kioti's especially in the 55 hp range or higher, I would automatically get the 65 model. Bigger chassis, bigger pto hp, basically bigger everything and yet the tractor isn't much large than their own 55 hp model,,,


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## zxracer3

> _Originally posted by Lamar Holland _
> *regardless of brand, including the big three, there will always be a lemon somewhere in the lineup.. If I was looking at Kioti's especially in the 55 hp range or higher, I would automatically get the 65 model. Bigger chassis, bigger pto hp, basically bigger everything and yet the tractor isn't much large than their own 55 hp model,,, *


After what chief told me I sent him on a mission to find the DK65. He was unable to find one. After what you said ill tell him that he really needs to see about looking into one. It sounds like a really good tractor.


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## Simpleprestige

Maybe it was a lemon, but I would still never buy one. There is a Kioti DK65 w/ cab on Tractorhouse, but it is the only one there. I don't know if your grandfather wants one with a cab or not.

http://www.tractorhouse.com/listings/detail.aspx?OHID=5125469&guid=BB77F2217EA445D79929E4B8F8FE7546


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## zxracer3

My grandfather went out on Sunday and looked at the dk65. He liked the tractor but realized that it was entirely too big. The dealer that I found for him was an extremely nice guy. I called him on Saturday and told him that my Grandfather wanted either the dk45 or 65. He called my Grandfather up and told him that he wanted to come out to his house and look at his property in order to give him a better idea of what he needed (My Grandfather is at least 30 miles away from the dealer). He came out told him that the dk45 would be better. My Grandfather then followed him back to look at the dk45 again and the dk 65. After liking the dk45 the dealer said that he would drop one off at his house on Monday for him to demo. He is outside playing with it right now as we speak. I was truly amazed at how helpful and nice the dealer was. My Grandfather so far was having nothing but nightmares. The dealer was probably one of the nicest guys I have ever talked too.


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## Live Oak

Sounds to me like you and your grandfather have found a dealer that is ready to sell a tractor and is customer service oriented. :thumbsup:


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## JDFANATIC

zx,

The dealer is so often more important than the tractor color or the country of origin. Do your due dilligence, and let your gut make the decision.


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## zxracer3

The one he demo'ed today is the non-hst. That is the one the dealer recommended him (He said it has more power.) Would he be better of with the hydrostatic transmission? Alright let me know what you guys think.


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## Live Oak

I think the HST would work very well with the FEL and rotary cutter. Not so sure I would want to use HST much for plowing or other high demand use. If you grandpa has been using gear shift machine and never used HST; he will probably never go back and kick himself for not trying HST sooner.   HST does have its limits but is a very good alround transmission.


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## zxracer3

All of his other tractors have been gear shift machines. He will be using it for everything. The dealer told him that there would be "much more power" with the gear shift machine then the hst. I told him that the hst seems easier and more relaxing to use. He is all about the gear shift though.


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## DK35vince

Personally I would stay with the gear.
The DK model tractors have the sycronized shuttle and syncronized main transmission. Thats what I have on my DK35, and it works nice..


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## zxracer3

> _Originally posted by DK35vince _
> *Personally I would stay with the gear.
> The DK model tractors have the sycronized shuttle and syncronized main transmission. Thats what I have on my DK35, and it works nice.. *


Yeah that is the one he is going to get. The dealer is picking up the demo and dropping off the new one tomorrow. He has been playing with it all day today and is very satisfied with it. The one he is getting has a cab with ac/heat, 4wd, FEL, brushog, and I may be missing a thing or two. He paid a little over 31,000 with no tax, since he has a "farm". The dealer did everything he could to drop the price down and was very helpful. He is even going to come and do the oil changes for a while. I’m going upstate for the 4th of July. If I can make my camera work I’m going to take some pictures and put them up to show you guys. Thank you everyone for all of your help. You made my grandfather very happy.


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## Simpleprestige

Sounds like he will have himself a nice machine. I wish we had dealers like that around here. If you ask a Kubota dealer why you should get a Kubota instead of a John Deere, they will simply say that Kubota makes their own engines. The total price was only a couple hundred dollars below MSRP.

Also, how come random letters that could not be offensive to anyone are bleeped out.


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## Live Oak

> _Originally posted by Simpleprestige _
> *Also, how come random letters that could not be offensive to anyone are bleeped out. *


I have been having a lot of problems with spa mmers trying to get onto TF lately. Just trying to make life tough for them in hopes they will go elsewhere. I am still fine tuning the censor. Please bear with us. :cheers:


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## Simpleprestige

Oh, yeah, thats fine. I thought that I was refferring to something that could be derogitory and not even know it. Thanks for doing your job.


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