# Heater plug, or Flame Heater Plug



## Brideck (Jan 13, 2007)

I am looking for help determing the correct part number and supplier for an intake manifold "Heater Plug". 

My manifold is a 1/2 NPT (BPT). I have found sources over the big pond, but the USA suppliers I have talked to can't tell me the tread size.

I tried a MF S.40627 but found it was a metric thread (20mm).

Any and all help would be appreciated.


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## Live Oak (Dec 22, 2003)

Not sure I can help you out with this but perhaps it might help other members if you could post the particular model and year tractor this part is for. Maybe someone with see it and remember a similar issue they have dealt with. 

Welcome to Tractor Forum by the way!


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## Brideck (Jan 13, 2007)

*More heater plug info*

The engine that needs the heater plug uses a Cummins 4BT 3.9L (an add-on, see below as to why)

The intake manifold opening is a 1/2 NPT. Many tractors use heater plugs such as Massey Ferguson, John Deere, Ford, Hitachi, Case, international Harvester to name a few.

The tractor is a military rough terrain forklift made by Entwistle in MA.

Add-on: Cummins provided an ether injection solution which can cause damage to the top piston ring. Furture similar but different models used a Flame heater plug. They have a kit but it is big bucks and there parts folks can't tell me if it will fit the 4BT model engine.


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## Live Oak (Dec 22, 2003)

I take it that you have already tried talking to a Cummins dealer and they were not able to help you with the part?


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## Brideck (Jan 13, 2007)

Yes I did talk to Cummins, in fact they recommended that I could tap in the knowledge base of the TractorForum.com

There are over ten different part numbers to choose from and I can find three manufactures of the heater plugs. They are in Turkey, CZ, and Germany.


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## Brideck (Jan 13, 2007)

Added one machine pic, as the Avatar.


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## Live Oak (Dec 22, 2003)

By chance do you know the military designator for this forklift? (ie: M 880)


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## Brideck (Jan 13, 2007)

The military designator for the forklift is M8606.


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## Live Oak (Dec 22, 2003)

*Re: More heater plug info*



> _Originally posted by Brideck _
> *Add-on: Cummins provided an ether injection solution which can cause damage to the top piston ring. Furture similar but different models used a Flame heater plug. They have a kit but it is big bucks and there parts folks can't tell me if it will fit the 4BT model engine. *


Believe it or not, you can use WD-40 in place of ether and it works very well and is not nearly as explosive but still works good in cold weather. That might be an option if you come up with an ether injection kit. 

These guys here might be able to help you out with some ideas and options. Hopefully one of them is an old motorpool sargeant or warrant and has worked on the M8606. I will keep looking and see what I can find but that forklift is an odd duck. I don't remember ever seeing a forklift such as that in my 21 years of active duty.


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## Live Oak (Dec 22, 2003)

I suspect you have already tried but in the off chance you have not. Have you tried contacting these guys?


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## Live Oak (Dec 22, 2003)

Are you sure it is not an M8909 or M9609 ?


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## Live Oak (Dec 22, 2003)

By the way, as best I can tell, the Army designated these forklifts as an M10A Rough Terrain Forklift. Wish I could be of more help. Hope the links to the Steel Soldiers will help you out.


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## Brideck (Jan 13, 2007)

As you found the current Entwistle model is the 8909. They look a lot alike, I think the newer model has four wheel crab capability. 

I did purchase there $100 manuals and found them OK for list of parts and exploded views, but very limited when covering machine repairs; there troubleshooting tree only covers the top level issues (repairs are not defined).

Beru Ag the German maker of Heater Plugs is sending me there parts catalog. The Distributor said they are having a rush on parts this last week. My guess that the tractor distributors are re-ordering stock. Hopefully the catalog will describe the sizes of these parts.

Thanks for the help.


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## Live Oak (Dec 22, 2003)

Not sure how much help I was but you are very welcome and hope you will post a follow-up to let us know how things turn out. Sounds like you are having trouble starting the engine when it is cold?


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## Morgan (Oct 26, 2006)

> _Originally posted by Brideck _
> *I am looking for help determing the correct part number and supplier for an intake manifold "Heater Plug".
> 
> My manifold is a 1/2 NPT (BPT). I have found sources over the big pond, but the USA suppliers I have talked to can't tell me the tread size.
> ...


I was a machinist for 15 yrs and if memory serves me right the (BPT) stands for British Pipe Thread and if so standard nor metric will work it must be British as it is different from standard and metric. This being the case you can retap it to one of the others or else you will have to go across the big pond for the part. We use to run a screw machine called a Wickman and all the parts had to be shipped from England nothing would interchange with anything we could find around here.


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## Brideck (Jan 13, 2007)

Oh no! I thought British Pipe Thread and National Pipe Thread were the same.

I just looked them up and find they are very close:
NPT 14 TPI, major diameter .840, 60 degree angle, taper 1 degree in 47'
BPT 14 TPI, major diameter .825, 57 degree angle, taper 1 degree in 47'

With the same taper the diameter difference I would think would be OK, the thread angle may be a problem. 

I don't even know if Cummins is BPT or NPT.

What do you think?


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## Morgan (Oct 26, 2006)

> _Originally posted by Brideck _
> *Oh no! I thought British Pipe Thread and National Pipe Thread were the same.
> 
> I just looked them up and find they are very close:
> ...


I would think that Cummins uses NPT and yes those above are very close however I knew they were a little diffent. I still have my machinist bible that cost around $150.00 15 yrs ago, I got out of the machinist world about 5 yrs ago and got back into the farming world so its a bit rusty. In that particual application it might work. However it may get tight to fast or not get tight at all. I would have to look it up with that being a pipe thread and being tapered.


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## Brideck (Jan 13, 2007)

*Starting*

You asked if I was having trouble starting. Well the Cummins 4BT starts pretty good; but when the temp is down to 20 F it needs a starting aid. With no glow plugs the ether system is the only aid and what commonly occurs is the ether will kick the engine over but the diesel just doesn't want to burn. 

The use of a heater plug is a excellent way to solve this issue. The heater plug heats up the fuel to a smokey state. Five to ten seconds of power to the heater plug will do the trick for this engine with outside temps at 30F (I don't have info for the 20F days). 

Now here is the scary part, there are many machines that do not have starting aids either glow plug, heater plugs or ether injection. 

The used equipment and equipment rental folks have been adding heater plugs to equipment that they are acquiring. It gives these used machine a new lease on life. I am trying to do the same thing. From my one days experience it was great to have the Cummings emmediately kick over.


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## Live Oak (Dec 22, 2003)

I have seen a cold start aid set up like that on my father's Allis Chalmers 5040. There is a heat element threaded into the intake manifold and the small fuel line dribbles fuel onto the heat element vaporizing it. WD-40 sprayed while cranking the engine will do the same but the air filter needs to be off for best effect. Not the best solution but better than ether in the interim until you get the manifold fuel heater.


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