# Check and clean your battery compartment after each use!



## Live Oak (Dec 22, 2003)

Since Duc brought up the sealed battery issue; I figured I would post this since many have this problem with batteries mounted in front of the radiator on our CUT's. This is a definite DO item (at least it is with mine)with the compact tractors with the battery in front of the radiator. You may not notice it much when used for short periods. After long periods of use such as 2 - 3 hours or more is when this condition appears. Check the battery compartment for battery acid which has vaporized or leaked from the battery caps. If it emits enough it will get drawn into the radiator and wreck havok with the metals later on down the road. I checked mine again after 3.5 hrs. of cutting and the battery caps were moist. I wash it down after each use now and plan to buy an Optima battery in the future. I posted about this before but wanted to follow up. Mine does not do it near as much as it did initially (perhaps due to the level filled at the factory) It is not apparent with the naked eye at first. If you happen to be working in dusty conditions, you can see where the dust has been absorbed into the battery acid at it is VERY apparent then. It is not a matter of over charging or bad battery. John Deere has a PIP for this but my battery already has it applied and it still has the problem. Now that the weather has cooled off, I have noticed this problem does not occur except for when I run the tractor for long periods of time (i.e. 2 or more hours where the trans. oil gets good and hot). I think the heat from the trans. oil cooler is what causes the batteries to vent. I will probably intall an AGM battery this Spring. Just a heads up for the rest of you.


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## ducati996 (Dec 27, 2003)

I second this advice as well....I havent found a battery that fits yet ( abeit I will try harder) because this problem is on mine as well. I wash it often but I want that hing out of my machine for good!!


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## farmallmaniac (Feb 16, 2004)

is the battery in front of the radiator on a 4100????
Ryan


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## Live Oak (Dec 22, 2003)

I believe it is in front of the radiator & trans. oil cooler on the 4100 as well.


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## farmallmaniac (Feb 16, 2004)

Hmm I'll have to look out for that. In the summer we use it 5 plus hours a day.


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## bo1 (Feb 3, 2004)

Chief.. you mentioned a JD PiP on the battery problem.. just what is that?


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## Live Oak (Dec 22, 2003)

> _Originally posted by bo1 _
> *Chief.. you mentioned a JD PiP on the battery problem.. just what is that? *


Hi Bo! Great to see you back! :thumbsup: PIP = Product Improvement Program. The fix John Deere came up with was changing the battery caps. The dealer I work with said the PIP changed over from the one piece that fits 3 holes to individual caps. Both don't work very well and in my opinion, the best fix would be a sealed battery. So far the sealed AGM type "Optima" type batteries don't have the power to turn the starter fast enough. My fix in the mean time was to wash down the battery and surrounding areas after each use and eventually the battery level has gone down some and the problem has not appeared lately but has not hit the summer temps yet. 

Here is a link to the John Deere PIP page where "supposedly" you can type in your machine serial # and it will list any PIP's that apply. I have yet to see it work correctly. John Deere may have updated it when they recently updated their website. 

PIP Check


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## Argee (Sep 17, 2003)

When I was working as a mechanic for Clark Equipment many years ago, we had a product (spray) called battery saver. When we did maintenance on the equipment we would spray this stuff on the battery to neutralize the acid. Wonder if it is still available? It was called *Battery Saver.*


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## bo1 (Feb 3, 2004)

Yes, thank you...on a high speed at the office. Didn't know that it was a problem.. makes real good sense and I'll need to look into it. I just stuck a new battery into it and beats the heck out of me what I put in. You know that I'm not going to spring for a battery after dropping a bunch of cash for a new one. I do need one in the boat and I just might change it to a sealed top. I'll look at it tonight. Mucho grasia, compadre.


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## Ernie (Mar 18, 2004)

*Acid Vapor and Boiling off*

Listening to the problem at hand And this is just a educated stab at a look from possoble over charging which heats the battery to point of acid cook off. I know little about thes small tractors buth charging systems are charging systems and if properly charging and properly maintained you will see little if any after many hours in the dirt and dust around the base of the caps.. Also look into maybe an over fill of acid, wont hurt to use the wifes turkey baster and suck some acid out.


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## Live Oak (Dec 22, 2003)

You are more than welcome bo! Are you dug out from all of that snow yet?


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## Live Oak (Dec 22, 2003)

*Re: Acid Vapor and Boiling off*



> _Originally posted by Ernieg _
> *Listening to the problem at hand And this is just a educated stab at a look from possoble over charging which heats the battery to point of acid cook off. I know little about thes small tractors buth charging systems are charging systems and if properly charging and properly maintained you will see little if any after many hours in the dirt and dust around the base of the caps.. Also look into maybe an over fill of acid, wont hurt to use the wifes turkey baster and suck some acid out. *


I was initially thinking the same thing but the battery acid level is already low. I think the problem is that the battery sits up against the transmission oil cooler which gets VERY hot. This in turn raises the temperature of the battery acid and causes out gassing. The vapors condense and are drawn back into the radiator.


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## Ernie (Mar 18, 2004)

*Re: Re: Acid Vapor and Boiling off*

I think the problem is that the battery sits up against the transmission oil cooler which gets VERY hot. Well, I live in Tampa area and run a Massey 240 4wd and it runs 8 hrs with battery temp around 235 degrees and never had a problem with a battery leaking out the caps unless it over charged. My reccomedation is to take it to a mechanic you can explain the problem to and let him check it over. Think of you car battery, get vey hot under that hood....:flamedevi


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## Live Oak (Dec 22, 2003)

My little 4410 battery is probably much smaller than the battery in your 240 and I would imagine that due to its smaller size and mass, absorbs more heat proportionally.


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## ducati996 (Dec 27, 2003)

*Re: Re: Re: Acid Vapor and Boiling off*



> _Originally posted by Ernieg _
> *I think the problem is that the battery sits up against the transmission oil cooler which gets VERY hot. Well, I live in Tampa area and run a Massey 240 4wd and it runs 8 hrs with battery temp around 235 degrees and never had a problem with a battery leaking out the caps unless it over charged. My reccomedation is to take it to a mechanic you can explain the problem to and let him check it over. Think of you car battery, get vey hot under that hood....:flamedevi *


This has been covered and addressed by John Deere already in most cases (warranty). If effects small cuts like mine JD 4100 and larger, and appears to effect the batteries without the individual vent caps mostly. It can seep when its at rest, so it not necessarily a heat issue alone and not a fluid or overcharging issue either. Its a venting issue and its well documented one on the cause. Thats all good that you dont have the problem with your MF. Its more specific in the non- sealed maintenance free batteries that JD chose to use..

Duc


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## Ernie (Mar 18, 2004)

*Its more specific in the non- sealed maintenance free batteries that JD chose to use.*

Thanks, its one of those problems that we have had with our JD 450 [dozer] but they installed a new alt. and it took care of it. Again thanks for the tip....


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## Live Oak (Dec 22, 2003)

I checked the output and charge up voltage of the alternator on mine and it was within specs. I already went over the potential causes with the shop tech at the dealer. That is why John Deere put out the PIP on it.


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## GreenMtnMan (Jan 9, 2004)

When my 4310 was at the dealer getting a backhoe installed I asked them about this problem. I had to get a new battery anyway (long story) so they changed the battery and then put special caps on it that are sealed with a vent hose that sticks out the bottom of the tractor. The service manager said the 790 has that style of battery, but the 790 battery won't fit in the 10 series tractors. I guess they put the caps from a 790 battery on the new one they put in my 4310. Anyway, seems like a good solution to the problem.


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## Live Oak (Dec 22, 2003)

Welcome back Ken! :friends: Great to see you posting! If you can find the time, some pics of the battery caps and that new hoe would be mighty interesting! :thumbsup:


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## GreenMtnMan (Jan 9, 2004)

OK, Chief! Thanks for the warm welcome.

Here's a pic of the new battery with remote venting cap.


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## Live Oak (Dec 22, 2003)

I think I like the solution your dealer came up with MUCH better! I will send my dealer a copy of the picture and see if they can send me a battery cap like that. Thanks for posting the picture Ken! :thumbsup:


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## Live Oak (Dec 22, 2003)

Hey Ken, I went to the JDparts website and the online parts manual shows only the individual battery caps. No one piece unit like you showed with the vent hose. Can you ask your dealer if they can find a part number for it? That would be great as we could all get that on order and fix the problem. Thanks!


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## GreenMtnMan (Jan 9, 2004)

I poked around on JDParts and I think the remote vented cap came off a 4300 battery. The only part number they list is that of the battery, LVA 11725. One would assume the battery would come with this cap, but it is entirely possible that the new batteries don't have it.


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## Live Oak (Dec 22, 2003)

Right on the money Ken. I found it but I agree with you that the this cap may not come on new batteries. I will call my dealer and see what they can come up with. Thanks for the help and suggestions! :thumbsup:


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## Live Oak (Dec 22, 2003)

I cross referenced the part # and LVA 11725 is replaced by part # TY25258 which I am thinking is the same battery we have in our tractors now. I think you lucked out and your dealer had an old 4300 battery laying around and hooked you up with a neat set up. I will still check with my dealer, he may have a 4300 battery laying around too. Ya never know.


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## GreenMtnMan (Jan 9, 2004)

I'm pretty sure the cap they gave me was brand new. It is pristine, not a scratch on it. Not sure where they got it. The service manager did say the JD rep was there that day and looked at the seized tilt wheel mechanism on my tractor so maybe he knew something about the battery cap.


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## Live Oak (Dec 22, 2003)

Just got off the phone with Ricky at the dealer and he said they have lots of those types of old style caps and will send me several in the mail. Thanks again for the heads up Ken!


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## GreenMtnMan (Jan 9, 2004)

It's good to hear they aren't a rare commodity. I came across another possible solution. These are "condensing" battery caps used in the solar energy industry. Sort of expensive for what they are, but if they work they're cheaper than a new radiator. It doesn't say that they will or won't work with automotive style batteries so that would have to be checked.

http://altenergystore.com/cart/486.html


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## Live Oak (Dec 22, 2003)

I never considered that. Good option! I did not see any pricing. Do you have any idea what they cost?


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## Live Oak (Dec 22, 2003)

You are a great "outside the box thinker"!


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## GreenMtnMan (Jan 9, 2004)

The linked site lists them for $9.95 EACH. I haven't shopped for best price but I did see them at one site for $7.50 each. That's $45 for six cells. A lot for battery caps, but less than a radiator


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## GreenMtnMan (Jan 9, 2004)

As far as thinking outside the box, Google is doing my thinking for me these days


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## GreenMtnMan (Jan 9, 2004)

Chief, did you get the battery caps yet?


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## Live Oak (Dec 22, 2003)

I'm sorry! I have been distracted with so many things, I forgot to follow up. Yes Ricky sent me an entire collection of various size cap assemblies like on your tractor now. He sent it to me the next day! Said they throw them away or they go out with the old batteries and gave them to me no charge. Said I can have more if I want them. I have not gotten around to installing them yet. It has been raining for the past 3 days and I have been REALLY sick. Some kind of killer flu going around and I am just starting to get over it. I will take some pictures of the install once I get it finished.


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## GreenMtnMan (Jan 9, 2004)

Sorry to hear you've been ill. There's a bad cold going around here too, my wife had it last week and I've got it now. That's the way it goes I guess. Hope you feel better soon!


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## Live Oak (Dec 22, 2003)

I am on the back side of it today. I have gone from my death bed to one foot in the grave to feeling crappy today. I don't have my voice back yet but that aweful sore throat is about gone and am feeling better. I have several projects I need to get pictures posted for. Will get them up soon!


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## Live Oak (Dec 22, 2003)

Ken, I meant to get back to you on the battery mod. you showed how you did on your 4310. I finally got the cap installed and ran a length of Tygon tubing to the undercarriage of the tractor. I also hooked up 2 bungee cords in an X pattern over the battery cap to hold it in place as it did not fit as tight as I would like. Otherwise, the mod. is identical to the picture you posted. Works GREAT!!!! Thank you VERY much for the tip! I owe you one!


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