# Ford 3000/4000 ground strap



## LHS (Aug 28, 2019)

I have a Frankenstein mid 70’s Ford 3000/4000 tractor that I cannot find the grounding strap on so it will not start. It started a week ago, and was running fine, but it must be loose and I cannot find it. I’m attaching some photos of the serial numbers and location of the battery cables but I’m puzzled. Had new cables made; reinstalled as before. POS to solenoid, NEG to starter. Engine will crank once then stop. Ground strap. Where? 
3 cyl diesel. 
Thanks in advance from a new old tractor owner.


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## Ultradog (Feb 27, 2005)

LHS said:


> I have a Frankenstein mid 70’s Ford 3000/4000 tractor that I cannot find the grounding strap on so it will not start. It started a week ago, and was running fine, but it must be loose and I cannot find it. I’m attaching some photos of the serial numbers and location of the battery cables but I’m puzzled. Had new cables made; reinstalled as before. POS to solenoid, NEG to starter. Engine will crank once then stop. Ground strap. Where?
> 3 cyl diesel.
> Thanks in advance from a new old tractor owner.
> View attachment 48683
> ...


The battery cables look ok from here.
Does the engine not turn over when you turn the key?
There is a neutral safety switch (NSS)on those. The high/low shift lever must be in neutral in order to engage the starter when you turn the key to start. Sometimes you have to wiggle the shifter while turning the key. There are two wires that drop down from under the dash that go into the top of the transmission to the NSS. Are those wires hooked up properly?
To test the starting circuit you can unplug the wires from under the dads and plug or pinch them together to test start the engine.
NSS is important though so don't permantly jerry rig it.
The numbers in your photos are casting numbers and do little to ID your tractor.
There are some numbers Hand Stamped (not cast into) the flat spot just above and behind the starter that will ID your tractor. You will likely have to scrape or wire brush some crud or paint and or use chaulk to read them.
If you carefully jot them down and post them here or post a good CLEAR photo we can ID your model, year built, etc.
Your photos are good btw.
See my photo for location.


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## LHS (Aug 28, 2019)

Ultradog said:


> The battery cables look ok from here.
> Does the engine not turn over when you turn the key?
> There is a neutral safety switch (NSS)on those. The high/low shift lever must be in neutral in order to engage the starter when you turn the key to start. Sometimes you have to wiggle the shifter while turning the key. There are two wires that drop down from under the dash that go into the top of the transmission to the NSS. Are those wires hooked up properly?
> To test the starting circuit you can unplug the wires from under the dads and plug or pinch them together to test start the engine.
> ...


Thanks, Ultradog. I’ll get on it and repost. I’ve had and driven old cars & trucks - foreign & domestic - for decades, but this tractor stuff is...interesting...and a bit quirky from the automotive norm.


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## LHS (Aug 28, 2019)

LHS said:


> Thanks, Ultradog. I’ll get on it and repost. I’ve had and driven old cars & trucks - foreign & domestic - for decades, but this tractor stuff is...interesting...and a bit quirky from the automotive norm.





LHS said:


> I have a Frankenstein mid 70’s Ford 3000/4000 tractor that I cannot find the grounding strap on so it will not start. It started a week ago, and was running fine, but it must be loose and I cannot find it. I’m attaching some photos of the serial numbers and location of the battery cables but I’m puzzled. Had new cables made; reinstalled as before. POS to solenoid, NEG to starter. Engine will crank once then stop. Ground strap. Where?
> 3 cyl diesel.
> Thanks in advance from a new old tractor owner.
> View attachment 48683
> ...





Ultradog said:


> The battery cables look ok from here.
> Does the engine not turn over when you turn the key?
> There is a neutral safety switch (NSS)on those. The high/low shift lever must be in neutral in order to engage the starter when you turn the key to start. Sometimes you have to wiggle the shifter while turning the key. There are two wires that drop down from under the dash that go into the top of the transmission to the NSS. Are those wires hooked up properly?
> To test the starting circuit you can unplug the wires from under the dads and plug or pinch them together to test start the engine.
> ...


I tried the “wiggle” on the high/low stick & it turned twice instead of once, then nothing. Also, the hand stamped numbers are BEHIND the starter, so I’ll have to remove it just to see them? Trying to avoid that til off/mow season. Is the NSS switch accessible with trans top removed or shifter levers, etc connected? Then I have a larger ball of wax again. I have not “pinched” the switch wires together yet. Really don’t want to short out anything.


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## Ultradog (Feb 27, 2005)

Behind as in aft - to the rear of.
See my photo.
Unplug the wires going to the transmission. If they are original they are bullet connectors - male and female. Plug them together - just to test if your NSS is working or not. Won't hurt anything.


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## LHS (Aug 28, 2019)

Ultradog said:


> Behind as in aft - to the rear of.
> See my photo.
> Unplug the wires going to the transmission. If they are original they are bullet connectors - male and female. Plug them together - just to test if your NSS is working or not. Won't hurt anything.


Sure appreciate your help. I’ll check it out in the a.m.


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## LHS (Aug 28, 2019)

Ultradog said:


> Behind as in aft - to the rear of.
> See my photo.
> Unplug the wires going to the transmission. If they are original they are bullet connectors - male and female. Plug them together - just to test if your NSS is working or not. Won't hurt anything.


Did the disconnect and wiggle; turned over and started for a few seconds, then same issue. Won’t continue to crank. And still don’t see serial number block aft of starter or elsewhere. ??


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## Ultradog (Feb 27, 2005)

For our next step first of all make damn sure the transmission is in neutral.
Then remove the spade clip that I'm pointing to with the orange pencil. Now take a very short screwdriver, wrench, whatever and touch it to BOTH the spade and the big lug where the battery cable hooks to the starter.
I use a lynch pin because its short and won't touch anything else except those two points.
It will spark a little when you make contact between the spade and the battery cable and the starter Should instantly start turning over the engine. Scares you the first time but won't hurt you or anything on the tractor.
We want to do this to completely bypass the starting circuit (key switch, NSS, etc) and check to see if the starter solenoid is working properly.
Remember: transmission in neutral First - both sticks.
As to the serial # on the flat spot above and behind the starter.
I mentioned in my earlier post that you will likely need to scrape or wire brush the crud and paint off and use chaulk to see the numbers. It does not look like you cleaned it.
For what it's worth, I/we will go to some effort to help a fellow fix his tractor. I just ran out an extension cord and light and half crawled under a tractor to snap the photo below for you.
But... We are not there to do things for you and must rely on you to follow our suggestions - to the letter. I assure you there are numbers there.


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## LHS (Aug 28, 2019)

I’ll find the serial numbers one way or another. I did the jump across a week ago and it spins the solenoid, but not the starter. I actually started it earlier today but it wouldn't run long enough to get the fuel going well. I’ll try the spade/lug again and report back. Believe me, both sticks are in neutral - and I do appreciate your help, no doubt.


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## LHS (Aug 28, 2019)

Did the spade-conn-to-starter sol jump. Turned the starter over continuously, so it must be the NSS or ignition switch? 
Scraped all off the area behind starter. Chalked it, too. Zippo. See attached. 
Thanks.


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## Ultradog (Feb 27, 2005)

LHS said:


> Did the spade-conn-to-starter sol jump. Turned the starter over continuously, so it must be the NSS or ignition switch?
> Scraped all off the area behind starter. Chalked it, too. Zippo. See attached.
> Thanks.


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## Ultradog (Feb 27, 2005)

Look at my photo again. Do you see the two big bolt holes just below the numbers? Look there on yours.


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## Hacke (Feb 22, 2011)

The loader is attached with two bolts at the flat spot where the numbers are, therefore you do not see the holes.
See image for directions to the correct place.

Attached image with directions for the engine numbers, and an original Ford information.

See the Manuals section for documents regarding your tractor. Look under "Tractors", the Ford stuff is there. Do not click "Ford" in the menu, somehow it gives you an empty space.

If the tractor is assembled in USA (Serial Number starting with a "C"), you will be better off with the Operator´s Handbook at N Tractor Club:
www.ntractorclub.com/manuals/tractors/Operators%20Manual%20All%20Purpose%20and%20LCG%20Tractors%202000,3000,4000,and%205000.pdf


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## Hacke (Feb 22, 2011)

I forgot an important part, here you can decode your numbers:
http://www.springfieldbiz.com/oaktree/rhcodes_serial.html


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## LHS (Aug 28, 2019)

Found numbers behind the loader control bracket.


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## LHS (Aug 28, 2019)

Ultradog said:


> Look at my photo again. Do you see the two big bolt holes just below the numbers? Look there on yours.


Found numbers behind loader control bracket. 10 14P 4B27B A257153*


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## LHS (Aug 28, 2019)

Hacke said:


> The loader is attached with two bolts at the flat spot where the numbers are, therefore you do not see the holes.
> See image for directions to the correct place.
> 
> Attached image with directions for the engine numbers, and an original Ford information.
> ...


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## Hacke (Feb 22, 2011)

It is assembled in 1974, February 27.

The tractor is assembled at the Antwerp plant in Belgium. Unfortunately they did not use the standard system for numbering. However, your number 10 14P might mean that it is a 10 chassie (Agricultural all purpose), 1 for diesel and 4 for Independent PTO 540rpm. The last letter should tell the type of transmission, but P is nothing I have seen before.
There should be a letter in the beginning of 10 14P telling what model it is, a C for 3000 or a D for 4000.

The Antwerp factory made a large variety of models/chassies and there are some owners on this and other forums that have some kind of 2000/3000 mixed models. Why are you unsure of which model your tractor is?

Could you post some pictures of the front axle and a picture from straight behind the tractor?

As I showed in a picture, you may check the numbers on the engine to find out what block you have.

The Antwerp tractors often have a metal plate with information, and it has been found on the vertical sheet metal surface above the radiator.

Edit***********
You can see where the plate on a 2000/3000 was found here:
https://www.tractorforum.com/threads/ford-2000-or-3000-project.38353/
(Picture six from top in first post.)
***********Edit


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## LHS (Aug 28, 2019)

Thanks, Hacke. I’ll post some pics tonight and check further in a few days. Gone for a bit. Big help. My decades-long friend I got it from never researched it. Had someone fix it when it didn’t work. Used it for 10+years. Tough old bird. Still won’t turn over consistently to stay started. I’ll likely put a remote push button start on it from the two terminals on the solenoid. Did this on my old Harley. Never a problem. If I can fix it right w/o taking half the tractor apart, though, I’ll do it.


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## LHS (Aug 28, 2019)

LHS said:


> Thanks, Hacke. I’ll post some pics tonight and check further in a few days. Gone for a bit. Big help. My decades-long friend I got it from never researched it. Had someone fix it when it didn’t work. Used it for 10+years. Tough old bird. Still won’t turn over consistently to stay started. I’ll likely put a remote push button start on it from the two terminals on the solenoid. Did this on my old Harley. Never a problem. If I can fix it right w/o taking half the tractor apart, though, I’ll do it.


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## Hightech1953 (Dec 30, 2018)

Do yourself a big favor and do not bypass the NSS . If you bypass the switch and it is not in neutral the tractor will start and haul ass . I always start mine with the fuel shut off pulled out first . If it don't jump a bit I know for sure the tractor and the NSS is closed and doing its job. If when I try to start with the fuel shut off pulled and the tractor starter does nothing I then know the tractor is in gear and the NSS is open and doing its job. Note : The NSS is activated by the HIGH/ LOW gear shift only !!!!!


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## Dmfoste1 (Apr 22, 2019)

Might want to also check the terminals and Spade connectors on the regulator. If I recall and is set up like my 4500, the positive comes off the starter, goes to the regulator, then to the key switch, then to the NSS, then to the starter solenoid. Any of those loose connections could cause some troubles.
The momentary push button switch is a great way to bypass all of that. But like it was said before make sure it's in neutral!!!! Hopefully all your wiring is stock and the NSS is part of the circuit.
I learned real quick at a young age, when I was building a truck what the NSS did. I had bypassed it, and I started the truck from outside with the window rolled down. When I turned the the key switch on, the truck started up, and took off across the yard. My only saving grace was I had my fingers holding on the keys and yank them out of the ignition as the truck took off. Scared the bejeebers out of me.
Silly question, is the battery fully charged? When it does turn over, does it spin fast, or slow? I read somewhere, that you have to cross two wires on the regulator to keep the tractor charging when you first hook the battery back up.


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## LHS (Aug 28, 2019)

Dmfoste1 said:


> Might want to also check the terminals and Spade connectors on the regulator. If I recall and is set up like my 4500, the positive comes off the starter, goes to the regulator, then to the key switch, then to the NSS, then to the starter solenoid. Any of those loose connections could cause some troubles.
> The momentary push button switch is a great way to bypass all of that. But like it was said before make sure it's in neutral!!!! Hopefully all your wiring is stock and the NSS is part of the circuit.
> I learned real quick at a young age, when I was building a truck what the NSS did. I had bypassed it, and I started the truck from outside with the window rolled down. When I turned the the key switch on, the truck started up, and took off across the yard. My only saving grace was I had my fingers holding on the keys and yank them out of the ignition as the truck took off. Scared the bejeebers out of me.
> Silly question, is the battery fully charged? When it does turn over, does it spin fast, or slow? I read somewhere, that you have to cross two wires on the regulator to keep the tractor charging when you first hook the battery back up.


Thanks. I’ll check those connections since I’m back in town now. A bypass button is my last resort, but I’m having to drag it off my driveway apron if it doesn’t start today. Can’t lift the loader and bushhog without power unless someone out there know a trick I don’t.


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## Ultradog (Feb 27, 2005)

LHS said:


> Thanks. I’ll check those connections since I’m back in town now. A bypass button is my last resort, but I’m having to drag it off my driveway apron if it doesn’t start today. Can’t lift the loader and bushhog without power unless someone out there know a trick I don’t.


I bought a 3600 some years ago that had caught on fire. A 3600 is the same machine as a 3000, just a little newer.
To move it I raised the loader with a HiLift jack. Then I cut two pieces of angle iron about 1 foot long and placed them on the lift cylinder rods and duct taped them in place. That kept the loader from dropping as my brother towed me home with the pickup.
You can kinda see the duct tape on the lift cylinder in the photo.
Just disconnect the mower and drag it out of the way with your pickup or whatever.


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## LHS (Aug 28, 2019)

Ultradog said:


> I bought a 3600 some years ago that had caught on fire. A 3600 is the same machine as a 3000, just a little newer.
> To move it I raised the loader with a HiLift jack. Then I cut two pieces of angle iron about 1 foot long and placed them on the lift cylinder rods and duct taped them in place. That kept the loader from dropping as my brother towed me home with the pickup.
> You can kinda see the duct tape on the lift cylinder in the photo.
> Just disconnect the mower and drag it out of the way with your pickup or whatever.
> ...


I’ll try that jack or pry bar and block the cylinders to keep the bucket off the ground just a bit. The bushhog will be a PITA to disconnect. I’m going to put some old plywood under the edges - same with the FEL if I can’t prop it up - and pull it about 20’ out of my drive. Thanks for your tips.


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## LHS (Aug 28, 2019)

Well, found a D in front of 10 14P so it’s a 4000. Good to know as the PTO “ON” lever is back, not forward like the 2000/4000. Jumped it off today at the solenoid, got it out of my driveway and did a bit of bushhogging. Ran fine. LOUD sucker! Until I can get someone out here that knows more ‘lectric on these old horses I’m putting a bypass starter button on it. Neutral first, neutral first! Right! Will post more as I get this old beast looking a bit better and less like a spaghetti-wired anomaly. Thanks all.


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## LHS (Aug 28, 2019)

Correction: 2000/5000 is PTO lever forward.


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## Ultradog (Feb 27, 2005)

I maybe shouldn't mention this as there's a lot of safety nannies on these sites.
I've bought and sold a few 3 cylinder Ford tractors over the last several years. It seems like every time I had one about ready to sell it needed some part or another. I have installed 3 new wiring harnesses on my 3000D and every time I've stolen it back off to put on another tractor to sell. So I've kind of given up having electrics on it. The only wires on it are the two battery cables. When I need to use it I throw a battery in it, hook the cables up then use a linch pin on the solenoid to start it. Been doing that for about 6 years now.
I always put it in neutral before starting it. Never fail.
There is No safety device that is as effective as the one that sits on your shoulders!
I'm thinking I will slow down with messing with tractors and one of these days will put a new harness and tach cluster in my 3000. It'll sure be nice to jump into the seat and start it with the key again.


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## LHS (Aug 28, 2019)

Great post, Ultradog. The Ford 4000 I have been “enjoying” is like your “no electrics” tractors that works great when you bypass & jump start its heart. No dash lights, no headlights. Old baby. 1974 Antwerp, Belgium. Today I touched the fuel line with my linch pin. Yep, I get to cut the line down, hook it back up and put the push button bypass on I SHOULD have done yesterday after I bushogged for about an hour. But I’m learning and having fun!


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## Hacke (Feb 22, 2011)

LHS said:


> Well, found a D in front of 10 14P so it’s a 4000.....


Just to confirm:
The block is 4000 as well.


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## LHS (Aug 28, 2019)

That’s great. So, not so Frankensteinish then, but spaghetti wiring for sure.


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## LHS (Aug 28, 2019)

Repaired fuel line. Bled fuel filter, injector pump, injectors rail line. 
Won’t spark. Where in the land of Goshen are the glow plugs on this sucker? On no schematic I’ve found. 
Gotta be spark. Fuel is new and is getting to injectors. Bypass starter button turns over engine just fine. 
Will not fire.


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## Dmfoste1 (Apr 22, 2019)

No glow plugs if that is the 201 diesel. It may have a thermostat that ignites the air in the bottom side of the air intake. It's not a thermostat that you would think of in the cooling system. It actually heats from the electrical connections and puts out a little bit of heat, to heat the air coming in. Mine did not have this option. If you're not getting any puh puh puh (compression from the exhaust ) when turning it over, you might want to check your valve lash. You'll have to pull the valve cover and check the spacing between the top of the valve, and the rocker arm with a feeler gauge.








I just rebuilt my 1968 201 4500 diesel and had to do this as well. I wasn't getting any compression from the engine because the valve lash was out. Diesels need air, fuel and compression to run. I highly doubt air is your problem since you're still on the forum  and you confirmed that you are getting fuel to the injector. So may want to look at the compression. I believe it needs 3 to 400 PSI to light the diesel.
I made a tester by getting a diesel compression test kit from Harbor Freight and use one of my old injectors to test the compression.








That's how I figure it out, the engine needed rebuilt because of lack of compression. If you want to read my build and learnings. Search for "new to me ford 4500 201 Fel BH". I tried to post some good information in there while I learned about mine.... like pressure test ,schematics ,valve lash, etc. I hope this helps. Good luck.
By the way injectors can be found on the internet for about $50. I had a local diesel shop quote mean $90 to check them each.


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## Ultradog (Feb 27, 2005)

LHS said:


> Repaired fuel line. Bled fuel filter, injector pump, injectors rail line.
> Won’t spark. Where in the land of Goshen are the glow plugs on this sucker? On no schematic I’ve found.
> Gotta be spark. Fuel is new and is getting to injectors. Bypass starter button turns over engine just fine.
> Will not fire.


No spark on a diesel - unless you have a loose wire somewhere. Wink.
As Dmfoste1 said, no glow plugs on the 3 cylinder Ford diesels.
There is a cold weather starting aid called a thermostart (not thermostat) in the intake manifold. It is just aft of the rubber tube that hooks the manifold to the air filter. Kinda looks like a spark plug. Has a small tube and a big wire going to it. It works by means of a bimetal valve that when you apply power to it it heats up and allows a small amount of fuel to dribble into the intake manifold which literally catches on fire and preheats the air going into the cylinders.
Sometimes those engines can be balky to start. Try pulling it with another tractor or pickup. That usually works.


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## LHS (Aug 28, 2019)

Dmfoste1 said:


> No glow plugs if that is the 201 diesel. It may have a thermostat that ignites the air in the bottom side of the air intake. It's not a thermostat that you would think of in the cooling system. It actually heats from the electrical connections and puts out a little bit of heat, to heat the air coming in. Mine did not have this option. If you're not getting any puh puh puh (compression from the exhaust ) when turning it over, you might want to check your valve lash. You'll have to pull the valve cover and check the spacing between the top of the valve, and the rocker arm with a feeler gauge.
> View attachment 49577
> 
> I just rebuilt my 1968 201 4500 diesel and had to do this as well. I wasn't getting any compression from the engine because the valve lash was out. Diesels need air, fuel and compression to run. I highly doubt air is your problem since you're still on the forum  and you confirmed that you are getting fuel to the injector. So may want to look at the compression. I believe it needs 3 to 400 PSI to light the diesel.
> ...


Thanks. I’ll check it out.


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## LHS (Aug 28, 2019)

Ultradog said:


> No spark on a diesel - unless you have a loose wire somewhere. Wink.
> As Dmfoste1 said, no glow plugs on the 3 cylinder Ford diesels.
> There is a cold weather starting aid called a thermostart (not thermostat) in the intake manifold. It is just aft of the rubber tube that hooks the manifold to the air filter. Kinda looks like a spark plug. Has a small tube and a big wire going to it. It works by means of a bimetal valve that when you apply power to it it heats up and allows a small amount of fuel to dribble into the intake manifold which literally catches on fire and preheats the air going into the cylinders.
> Sometimes those engines can be balky to start. Try pulling it with another tractor or pickup. That usually works.


‘nother thingbto check. Thanks!


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## LHS (Aug 28, 2019)

Ok, I’m about ready to take everything off this damn Ford 4000 from the injectors to the injector pump, filers, fuel rail et al. I have bled every part and it will not feed fuel to the top. Start it up fine with ether spray. Dies and soon as it’s gone. 
Will NOT feed fuel to the injectors. 
WTH?


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## Dmfoste1 (Apr 22, 2019)

Trying to help you out, this one's a challenge!!!

Let's recap
Tractor was running fine one week before your post.
First issue was engine not turning over. Correction to that was bypassing the key and electronics, by using a jumper switch.
Next issue was engine would not fire but is turning over properly with use of the jumper switch.
Fact-engine will fire with either and then peter out when either is consumed.
Rhetorical question- will either light on a diesel motor with lower compression, then it will with diesel fuel? 

Questions- 
1)Have you done a compression test? If so what were the findings?
2)Is there diesel fuel in the oil? Suggests fuel passing rings and not igniting due to low compression.
3) Is there plenty of good diesel fuel in the tank?
4) Is the shut-off valve on the fuel tank "on" when starting ?
5)Is the kill switch on the injector pump in the correct position?
7)Is there fuel going back to the tank via the return lines off the injectors? (Flow of fuel, use of clear hose temporarly to see this, or a separate "catch tank", verifing fuel flow.
8)Is the fuel cap on the fuel tank not allowing air in causing a vapor lock? Loosen fuel cap and try starting.
9) Is most of the air bleed from fuel system and all connections tight? Bleed fuel system starting at tank to fuel filter to injector pump to injectors. 
10) Has IP been rotated, or are bolt to IP loose? Mine is set to 0. There is a line on side of IP that corresponds to degrees "chart" on back of timing cover where IP bolts on.


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## Hacke (Feb 22, 2011)

In your picture, it looks like the stop cable is a bit odd and that the stop lever is not pushed forward all the way to it's stop.
I have marked the lever red in a copy of your picture.

When starting (and running) the engine, The lever should be positioned like in this picture:
https://thumbs.ebaystatic.com/d/l400/pict/361797219427_1.jpg


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## LHS (Aug 28, 2019)

Dmfoste1 said:


> Trying to help you out, this one's a challenge!!!
> 
> Let's recap
> Tractor was running fine one week before your post.
> ...


I really appreciate the effort, Dmfoste1. I’m hoping the fuel cap vapor lock is the solution. I’ve had several old cars this was common on. I’ll change the book to be sure there’s no fuel in it. 
Diesel in tank is fresh. I still think it’s air in the system somewhere. I replaced the elbow fuel line with new compression fitting after I burnt a hole in it, so I think air is the issue. 
Don’t know how to do a compression check as this thing has no plugs. Put a gauge on each injector?
Will check the kill switch position again. 
I’ll report back. Thanks again. 


Hacke said:


> In your picture, it looks like the stop cable is a bit odd and that the stop lever is not pushed forward all the way to it's stop.
> I have marked the lever red in a copy of your picture.
> 
> When starting (and running) the engine, The lever should be positioned like in this picture:
> https://thumbs.ebaystatic.com/d/l400/pict/361797219427_1.jpg


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## LHS (Aug 28, 2019)

Hacke said:


> In your picture, it looks like the stop cable is a bit odd and that the stop lever is not pushed forward all the way to it's stop.
> I have marked the lever red in a copy of your picture.
> Rechecking. Thanks!
> 
> ...


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## LHS (Aug 28, 2019)

Injector pump still not sending fuel to injectors even after bleeding every screw possible. Will remove all injector lines today to check for blockage(s). I really hope it’s not the $500 pump. Thanks all.


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## Ultradog (Feb 27, 2005)

Leave the lines alone.
It's most likely the metering valve in your pump is stuck closed.
Read this post I made on another thread here. It is not hard to do and I have done it with a loader in the way. Use a mirror if need be.
https://www.tractorforum.com/posts/272041/


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## Ultradog (Feb 27, 2005)

Dmfoste1 said:


> Trying to help you out, this one's a challenge!!!




Wish I had a nickel (or at least an acknowledgement) when someone used my photo...


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## pogobill (Jan 31, 2012)

Thanks Ultradog, I see your post from Jan 11, 2019. Sorry no nickel, but we do appreciate the fact that you do share your knowledge!
Cheers Mate!!


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## Dmfoste1 (Apr 22, 2019)

Good thinking Ultradog!!! I had forgot about the dang metering valve..... Where's my old IP? I'll get a pic of the inside when the top is removed. Be patient, gentle and pay attention when you pull it apart. I didn't pay attention and I didn't know which of the 3 holes the spring was in. Of course after disassembly it didn't matter anyway seeing the insides of mine... let's see if I can find that old pump to post a pic.


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## Dmfoste1 (Apr 22, 2019)

PICTURES!!!! YAY!!!

Pic1
Using the tip of a screwdriver pointing to 1st set of 3 holes to pay attention to.









Pic2
Second set of 3 holes to pay attention to.








Pic3
Piece with nipple that rotates an pushes slide bar ...(next pic)








Pic4
Slide bar moves back and forth.. (2pics)
















Slide bar pushes on lever...
Pic5








And delicate spring pushes back
Pic6









If the delicate spring can't push back the valve will be stuck... Not allowing fuel to pass.

One last thing to mention is the 2 small sealing washers when taking apart. DONT LOOSE THEM!!!
PIC7









Thanks to Ultradog for remembering this!!!


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## Dmfoste1 (Apr 22, 2019)

In addition to the pics, this pump was taken apart and it is unknown which holes the springs go in. Pictures were provided for "looking inside", labeling parts and reference only. Hoping it give you some insight of what you can expect.


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## Ultradog (Feb 27, 2005)

Dmfoste1 said:


> In addition to the pics, this pump was taken apart and it is unknown which holes the springs go in. Pictures were provided for "looking inside", labeling parts and reference only. Hoping it give you some insight of what you can expect.


Dmfoste1,
He doesn't need to pull the cover off completely and thus mess with the tombstone spring.
Just lift the cover about 1/2" and reach in there with a small screw driver to free up the MV.


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## LHS (Aug 28, 2019)

Ultradog said:


> Dmfoste1,
> He doesn't need to pull the cover off completely and thus mess with the tombstone spring.
> Just lift the cover about 1/2" and reach in there with a small screw driver to free up the MV.


Thanks to all for the input. I will take apart Monday when company isn’t here and I can cuss in private.


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## LHS (Aug 28, 2019)

Ultradog said:


> Dmfoste1,
> He doesn't need to pull the cover off completely and thus mess with the tombstone spring.
> Just lift the cover about 1/2" and reach in there with a small screw driver to free up the MV.


The slide bar moves back and forth but there is no spring connected to it to “return it” to the open position. 
Buttoned back up, bled fuel filter and pump. Still no fuel to the injectors.


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## Ultradog (Feb 27, 2005)

LHS said:


> The slide bar moves back and forth but there is no spring connected to it to “return it” to the open position.
> Buttoned back up, bled fuel filter and pump. Still no fuel to the injectors.


Not sure if I followed you but there is no spring on the slide bar. The spring is #7/8 in that photo.
If you got that far in there and did not free up the metering valve it would be a shame.


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## LHS (Aug 28, 2019)

Ultradog said:


> Not sure if I followed you but there is no spring on the slide bar. The spring is #7/8 in that photo.
> If you got that far in there and did not free up the metering valve it would be a shame.


Where is the actual valve? There’s on on the bottom of the unit under this bolt.


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## Hacke (Feb 22, 2011)

I forgot:
In Dmfoste1's Pic5 the screwdriver is pointing at it.


This site has got some nice documents:
https://injectionpumps.co.uk/

If you click on part number 78 in this picture, you will get an exploded diagram and a picture of the valve:
https://injectionpumps.co.uk/interactive/interactive-cav-dpa-parts-diagram.htm

Another diagram (not interactive):
https://injectionpumps.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2017/07/DPA.png


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## Ultradog (Feb 27, 2005)

LHS said:


> Where is the actual valve? There’s on on the bottom of the unit under this bolt.


I can't tell you about the metering valve itself.
The part you want to take a small screwdriver and free up is the part the red arrow is pointing to.
Move it back and forth till the spring 78 will move it on its own.


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## LHS (Aug 28, 2019)

Ultradog said:


> I can't tell you about the metering valve itself.
> The part you want to take a small screwdriver and free up is the part the red arrow is pointing to.
> Move it back and forth till the spring 78 will move it on its own.


Okay, got it now. I’ll take it apart again tomorrow to see if I can free it up. Thanks. This thing is indeed a challenge.


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## Dmfoste1 (Apr 22, 2019)

Did you get the ol girl running?


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## LHS (Aug 28, 2019)

Nope. It’s the injector pump. Worn out. It’s been started too many times with ether fluid - apparently always - so I found some good local tractor guys. We’ll be putting new pump, R&R injectors, new ignition switch in, then this beast will roar again. Thanks for your help Dmfoste1, UltraDog & Hacke. Will post when done.


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## LHS (Aug 28, 2019)

LHS said:


> Nope. It’s the injector pump. Worn out. It’s been started too many times with ether fluid - apparently always - so I found some good local tractor guys. We’ll be putting new pump, R&R injectors, new ignition switch in, then this beast will roar again. Thanks for your help Dmfoste1, UltraDog & Hacke. Will post when done.


Up & running again with new injector pump & ignition switch...then mud city in the high grass when I was shredding. A neighbor’s Case beast got me out. My 4000 looks like a tinker toy.














LOL!


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## pogobill (Jan 31, 2012)

Almost makes you wish you hadn't got it up and running for a couple of more days!!
Glad you got it out!


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## Dmfoste1 (Apr 22, 2019)

Glad to hear you're back in business!!! That 4000 is a pretty decent size tractor until you posted the other one next to it. That things huge. Congrats on getting her running!!! Thanks for the pics.


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