# Long 460 Not Starting - Need Some Pointers (Fuel related?)



## 6.7LMegaCab

Hey All! This 460 I bought a few months back has been running and starting flawlessly despite its age and condition. A few days ago, I started noticing problems while moving dirt and just as I finished loading the last bucket for the evening, it died. The next morning, I changed the fuel filter (looks like it hadn't been changed in 20 years) and bled the system. Fortunately, I was able to start it again and it ran fine for a while, until it died again, and had to finish moving dirt the good ol' fashion way...manual labor lol.

It turns over fine. But it doesn't appear to be getting any fuel. So what I've discovered is that changes have been made to it since during the time it was owned by the Dept of Labor (evidence of owner by a few stamps on the tractor) or changed hands since it was auctioned off. There is only one fuel filter and the thermostarter system is non-functioning, as in it's been removed, the glowplug is still in place, but the fuse is not connected. The thermostarter canister is still there, but the gravity feed line is capped off. It's a mess, but it was starting and running with zero issues. 

Back to the fuel. When I removed the banjo bolts at the top of the fuel injectors to bleed the system, per the owners manual, I noticed injector 2 wasn't bleeding any fuel, so I'm guessing it's something at the injection pump or at the injector?

Here's some pictures. I'm thinking about just replacing the injection pump, and 2 injectors, as the front injector was replaced before I bought the tractor. I'll probably just get new injector lines and sealing washers as well. Fuel pump was replaced around the same time as one of the injectors.

What else should I check before placing an order? Once I finish the bulk of work, the engine is getting a bit of an overhaul as the oil is mixing with coolant, with no coolant in the crankcase. Fortunately, it appears to be cooling just fine and not overheating.

Is it critical to have two fuel filters or were there certain years that only had one filter?

Thank you in advance for any help with this starting/running issue.


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## sixbales

The banjo bolts are for the fuel return system (returns excess fuel to the tank). To bleed the injectors, crack open the injection line connectors (usually takes a 5/8" wrench). 

My tractor has only one fuel filter and it works fine. I've owned the tractor for 30+ years.


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## 6.7LMegaCab

Thank you. That's just what the manual said to fully loosen those connections and start the tractor. Once started and all air is out, tighten up the connections and the bleed screw #3 on the injection pump. When I attempted that yesterday, no fuel was making its way out of the top of the injectors, leading me to believe it could be the injection pump. 

I'll try what you suggested as well. Thanks for the info about the single filter.

Sent from my SM-G955U1 using Tapatalk


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## gasmith10

6.7LMegaCab said:


> Thank you. That's just what the manual said to fully loosen those connections and start the tractor. Once started and all air is out, tighten up the connections and the bleed screw #3 on the injection pump. When I attempted that yesterday, no fuel was making its way out of the top of the injectors, leading me to believe it could be the injection pump.
> 
> I'll try what you suggested as well. Thanks for the info about the single filter.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G955U1 using Tapatalk


Um, I just want to say that once you turn the tractor over and bleed all the air at the injectors, you tighten all of the injector connections back up, leaving only the top bleed screw on the injection pump loose a couple of turns. From this point, turn the tractor over for about 30 second intervals, ensuring cooling periods in between, until the tractor starts. After the tractor starts, tighten up the top bleed screw on the injection pump.

Another possible cause for lack of fuel to the system is, the fuel hose that comes from the tank to the fuel lift pump gets old and brittle on the inside as causes restriction of the fuel. I've had this happen to me and it took me a little while to find it but, the fuel hose had deteriorated on the inside, right at the fuel cock on the bottom of the fuel tank and was restricting flow. A prompt replacement of that fuel hose cleared the problem right up.

Oh, and check to ensure you don't have trash or algae in the bottom of your fuel tank. 

Sent from my SM-N950U1 using Tapatalk


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## 6.7LMegaCab

Yup, you're right. I transcribed my notes wrong from the operator's manual...it was too dang hot out to bring my laptop outside. Either way, it started right up, despite doing it wrong (by not tightening the connections at the top). I'll check that line from the fuel petcock and make sure it's clear. Using the manual pump lever and cracking loose any connection from the filter or the bleed screws, fuel will come out, so at least something is there...perhaps not enough though.

I'll check for gunk in the tank as well...

Can the injectors be removed to check for fuel spray patterns? I guess that'll be a bit of a challenge with hard lines going to each of them. Hmm.


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## 6.7LMegaCab

I checked the line coming off the petcock of the tank. All clear. Fuel streams out very well from the petcock as well. There is a little bit of sediment at the bottom of the tank, but no algae. This tank might have been cleaned at some point as the guy I bought it from said he has removed the tank a couple times to do some work, but uncertain on that front.

There is a leak coming from some connection on the bottom of the injection pump, engine side. I couldn't tighten it any more than what it already is. If I loosen the connection coming from the fuel filter to the front of the injection pump, moving the pump lever, fuel comes out. However, very little, if any fuel, is coming out of the bleed ports on the injection pump now. I did loosen the hard line from the injection pump to the front injector, and cranked the engine and no fuel was coming out. 

Could this be a combination of an injection pump and fuel pump or possibly just the injection pump?


Also, is the firing order 1-2-3 from the rear of the engine to the front or front to rear?


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## sixbales

Mike the pump guy will be along shortly (I hope) to help you with injection pump questions. 

Firing order always starts from the front to the back.


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## 6.7LMegaCab

Many thanks for the reply! That's what I thought but couldn't find anything concrete in the manual for which cylinder was number 1.


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## thepumpguysc

U might have your terminology backwards.??
The FRONT of the pump is where it bolts to the engine, also known as the DRIVE END.
BACK of the pump is where the steel lines are.. also known as the INLET..
If u loosen the BLEED SCREW BY THE NAME PLATE and spin the engine, it should shoot a stream of fuel.. now tighten..
Fuel return on an injector means nothing..(top banjo)


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## thepumpguysc

If u have the 3 pc filter assembly..
Filter head, filter, bowl, all held together by a single bolt that goes thru the center..?? It’s critical that the top oring gets placed UP IN THE FILTER HEAD..
NOT ON THE FILTER..
If it falls out of the groove and settles ON THE FILTER, it’ll choke off the fuel.

Check the mounting ear on the pump..
it will have a timing line etched into it..
THAT LINE will match up with some degree marks or another line stamped into the block.. check to see what it’s set at.. DONT SCRAPE THE PUMP..
Get some paint/gasket remover in a spray can..


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## 6.7LMegaCab

thepumpguysc said:


> U might have your terminology backwards.??
> The FRONT of the pump is where it bolts to the engine, also known as the DRIVE END.
> BACK of the pump is where the steel lines are.. also known as the INLET..
> If u loosen the BLEED SCREW BY THE NAME PLATE and spin the engine, it should shoot a stream of fuel.. now tighten..
> Fuel return on an injector means nothing..(top banjo)


I loosened the bleed screw by the nameplate and turned the engine over. There was a stream of fuel. I tightened it back up.


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## 6.7LMegaCab

thepumpguysc said:


> If u have the 3 pc filter assembly..
> Filter head, filter, bowl, all held together by a single bolt that goes thru the center..?? It’s critical that the top oring gets placed UP IN THE FILTER HEAD..
> NOT ON THE FILTER..
> If it falls out of the groove and settles ON THE FILTER, it’ll choke off the fuel.
> 
> Check the mounting ear on the pump..
> it will have a timing line etched into it..
> THAT LINE will match up with some degree marks or another line stamped into the block.. check to see what it’s set at.. DONT SCRAPE THE PUMP..
> Get some paint/gasket remover in a spray can..


Yes, you are correct about the filter assembly that I have. It was a pain in the rear, but I was very diligent in getting that top o-ring in place prior to putting the filter on. 

I found the timing mark on the pump and it lines up with a groove on the block.


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## thepumpguysc

R u SURE the shut off is in the RUN position.?? I’ve seen some where u PULL the cable to start.. instead of pull to shut off..
MAKE SURE U have the THROTTLE LEVER WIDE OPEN while starting.


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## 6.7LMegaCab

This model is where you push the cable in to start/run and pull to shut off. Throttle lever wide open, start/stop cable pushed in, and no go, just turns over. if I spray a little bit of starting fluid, it'll fire up no problem, just won't stay running.

It was running great until earlier in the week. Changed filter after it stopped running. Was able to get it going again and it worked great for a few hours. Died on the way back to get another bucket of topsoil and that's where it sits.

I'm guessing with the bleed screw open near the nameplate and fluid streams out when turning over, it's something between the pump and the injectors, and not between the filter and pump?


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## thepumpguysc

Loosen the steel lines AT THE INJECTORS..
Loosen the bleed screw by the name plate and crank the engine.
Get a good stream of fuel from bleeder W NO AIR and tighten.
W ALL the lines from the pump loosened AT THE INJECTORS, crank the engine until fuel spits out W NO AIR and tighten.
LOOSEN ALL THE LINES (3) at once, NOT 1 @ a time..
Good luck


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## thepumpguysc

1 more thing to “drive home”..
U DONT loosen the banjo bolts ON THE INJECTORS..
U LOOSEN THE LINES COMING FROM THE PUMP.!!!
If your just loosening the banjos, ur introducing air back into the filter.!!


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## 6.7LMegaCab

Sir (@thepumpguysc), you are amazing! I got it fired back up! Looks like lots of air in injector 2. 1 and 3 seemed pretty clear. Once the bubbles went away, I tightened the hardlines at the injectors and it fired right up! Thank you! I'm still replacing the pump though...there is an evident leak somewhere on it that is caking everything around it with fuel. It seems like the pump is good just leaks, which I'm guessing might be introducing air into the system?


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## thepumpguysc

Why not keep your money in the family & send it to me.??
U can click on my screen name and go to my profile page for contact info.
Or put : @ aol.com after my screen name in your home mail service.


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## 6.7LMegaCab

Well, as I was making sure everything was tight, I slipped and cracked a line loose on an injector while it was running. Tons of air in the system now. Been working on bleeding it again...

About to send you an email...


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## 6.7LMegaCab

Just wanted to update this post. After following the recommendations from Mike @thepumpguysc, the tractor ran great for a few more days but slowly made its way to not starting again because of the fuel pump. It was to the point where I would move a So, I did what any sensible guy should do and sent the injection pump to Mike.

The story behind the tractor and the pump is unknown, but apparently, it had been removed and messed with, using cardboard as a gasket and internals installed incorrectly, well before my time (just bought it around March). Heck, it was even missing a nut that secured the pump to the timing housing.

Long story short, I got the pump back yesterday and let me tell you, it was unrecognizable...it looks brand spanking new! After getting the pump installed last night, and the lines hooked up and bled this morning, the tractor started right up, and runs STRONG!

If anyone is having problems with the injection pump on their tractor, send it to Mike! He'll be honest with you with whatever problems are found and let you know any lingering unforeseen issues that need to get resolved.

Oh! Don't do what I did and remove the levers on the pump. I have zero idea why I did that, other than I was in pump removing mode and saw two nuts and removed them. They are necessary for him to set the speed and test the pump.

Hopefully this helps out others with a Long tractor or any other tractor for that matter.


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## thepumpguysc

Thanks, it was my pleasure..
Happy tractoring..


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