# New vs Old



## Blert (Sep 19, 2010)

"They don't build em like they used to" - this is what I kep hearing from folks selling older used tractors. My needs are snow removal (300 ft drive), lawn and tilling. I've been looking at some old and/or restored models (Bolens ht23, Troy GTX20, various Deere's). The thing I am finding is the prices aren't that great. So the question is, is it worth buying old? Some of the new tractors look great but when you go beyond the box store models the prices really start to jump. Thoughts, advice? Thanks.


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## Hoodoo Valley (Nov 14, 2006)

Welcome to the forum, Blert! I'd keep a diligent eye on the older stuff, and certainly entertain the idea of buying new from the dealer too! It's a shame that the person typically selling an older machine is hoping to retire from that one sale, and it's also a shame that a new tractor cost as much or more than a house or a car from 40 years ago. Winters coming, and times are rough too, and it just becomes a waiting game if you're patient, as lots of people are out of work, and at least on craigslist in my area, there are some great deals to be had. Also, just about every dealer is offering zero percent financing, and that's like free money in a sense. What model or manufacturer are you leaning toward?


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## MFreund (May 2, 2008)

I would never give up fuel injection and hydro for carbs and gears. For me that rules out the old. I am however, not against looking for good used. If you want to find a good used you need to do the homeowrk. Get out there and go look and drive some of the used. If you are not in a hurry keep looking, watching and comparing and soon you will KNOW a good tractor at a bargain price. There is not a "best" tractor, just what is best for you.

Whatever you buy, make sure there are parts easily available. A bargain tractor is no bargain if you have to wait two weeks during mowing season for parts.


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## briggs (Sep 2, 2010)

i like the older ones myself .The newer stuff cant take it like the older ones can .....The older Deers where great so was the cub cadet ,Case made a nice little unit also ..Shine looks good but it dont get the job done..not saying they dont make good ones new but they are pricey ..I would take a good old DEER or CUB any day for the right price


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## Mickey (Aug 14, 2010)

A lot of people don't want to pay any more for a small "tractor" today than some models cost decades ago. Only way that can happen is for mfgrs to make them cheaper. One can still find decent machines today but don't expect them to come at a low cost.

From what you describe as your tasks, you should be looking for a GT (garden tractor) not an LT (lawn tractor i.e. riding lawnmower).

Old quality machine are going to hold their value as they are quality. About 7 yrs ago I replaced my JD 318 and at the time it still had a retail value of $2000-$2500. MY old Bolens a 1970 model cost $2k with a mower and tiller.


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## kau (Sep 15, 2003)

I've found that statement to be true. I have Craftsman tools from the 70's still working, I have Craftsman tools I bought in the last 5 years that have broken or have something messed up.

My LGT was a hand me down. Doubt I would ever buy new.


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## Blert (Sep 19, 2010)

Thanks for the replies! I'm in northern New England which for some reason seems to add to price. Yankee frugality I guess. I am trying to keep it under $3000. I can get a TroyBilt Gtx20 in good shape with 600 hours for aroubd $2500, and GT2000 for a little less, but then there's the parts issue. A lot of Deere's around but most pretty beat. There's also a Deere 318 ($1500) no smoke or leaks but no hour meter! There are folks up here that do restores but they are $$$$. New under $3000 with a blower, I'm only seeing box store models, unless I'm missing something. I like do like the old tractors but I know that novelty does not equate to longevity and practicailty. Thanks again!


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## Hoodoo Valley (Nov 14, 2006)

I'd be looking a bit closer at the JD 318 you mentioned. No hour meter is no big deal so long as it's been cared for. I have a 316 with no hour meter, and it's not needed, because the thing just goes and goes and goes! Have a mechanic check it out if you feel uneasy, but the classics live on for a reason. Compare the frames and simplicity and you'll start seeing why the older stuff is king!


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## Bamataco (Apr 22, 2009)

One more thing that I think needs to be thrown into the mix here is your mechanical ability. And if you want to work on the tractor or work with the tractor. I know that I'm not a mechanic. So I bought a new Craftsman GT5000. I did this because I needed to work with the tractor not on it. 
Another thing to consider here is where you live. I live in New Mexico and you just don't see any of the better older tractors around here for sale. So I would have to add shipping charges to any tractor that I bought.


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## Hoodoo Valley (Nov 14, 2006)

I've had a super good run with my 26 year old machine, and as I too am horrible at mechanics, I have had to do very little on this older Deere, chiefly, I replaced both belts to the mower deck very recently, the fuel pump last year, and the coil about 10 years ago. Otherwise, it's been a runner, and I should point out that eventually, the new stuff will need work and attention, and they are not as simple as the older stuff. Thus far, I've been able to keep the old Deere going, but when I look at the newer Deeres, they look dreadfully scary to work on! But I do understand the "New" feel and sensation!


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## rsmith335 (Jun 2, 2010)

I stumbled upon a 51 Ford 8N with 1500 hours on it, bought it and a new Muatori 5 foot finish mower. Had a blade, culitavator and other implements given to me. After I bought new turff tires, I have less than $ 3,500.00 in the whole kit and acabootle. And it mows, moves snow great. And rides alot smother and faster than my JD GT 235. Cut 3 hours off my mowing time. I like old, the tractor is 59 years old and works great. Parts are cheap compaired to newer tractors. My neibors all have new zero turn mowers $ 7,500.00 - $ 10,000.00 and they look like bobble heads mowing (beats the crap out of them). And all thet can use their high dollar equipment for is mowing. And I ride in comfort.


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## rsmith335 (Jun 2, 2010)

I forgot to mention, I stay cooler and ALOT CLEANER than riding the JD GT 235. If you have alergises this would be a plus. Good Luck


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## Mickey (Aug 14, 2010)

The JD 31X series has to have been out of production for 20 yrs. The 318 came with an hr meter. Wonder what happened? The Onan flat twin found in these machines has been out of production for about 10 hrs. Onan part prices were somewhat high to begin with and I'm sure they've not gotten any cheaper.

Looking for an older GT, IMO you'd want a cast iron front and rear axle and I'd consider it a plus if trans and pto where shaft drive.


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## TeamCheap (Dec 22, 2009)

I love my sears suburban 18/6 so far and find it very easy to work on for the most part.

I do have concerns about the onan 18 when/if it dies and after seeing how much parts can cost for that engine I thought about maybe converting it to diesel if I ever need to repair/replace that engine.

Nothing fancy on it just simple straight forward time tested engineering.



If I could get my hands on a roper aluminum upper front grill and dash for it I'd be very happy.


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## Bamataco (Apr 22, 2009)

TeamCheap said:


> I love my sears suburban 18/6 so far and find it very easy to work on for the most part.
> 
> I do have concerns about the onan 18 when/if it dies and after seeing how much parts can cost for that engine I thought about maybe converting it to diesel if I ever need to repair/replace that engine.
> 
> ...


 I never had a diesel tractor but I have had a diesel truck. I know that diesel truck parts can get very expensive. Is that true of diesel engines for tractors?


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## Hoodoo Valley (Nov 14, 2006)

Yup! But they last so much longer too.


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## IH farm boy (Aug 29, 2010)

i have mostly older stuff, you cant beat them for the way there built , they are simple and iff you keep them up with preventative maintence there pretty trouble free, and one thing i have found is the older stuff you can fix cheaper , becasue you can get just the part you need to fix it instead of whole assemblies, i do like some of the features of the new stuff . and there is older equipment out there with the same features. for stricktly mowing i dont mind the new stuff , if you going to work the crap out of it old is the only way to go i have a old craftsman i use for pushing snow pulling my heavy yard equipment drags rakes , areators , sweepers , and i have a newer cub for mowing and i have two old cubs im reasurecting to be my work horses for plowing tilling you have to get a pretty expensive tractor thats twice as big to be built like the old cubs. even the old simplicites and deeres were built pretty good , just deere drug there feet a little puttin the hydro on the big tractors


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## Waldershrek (Nov 23, 2009)

Everything built today just seems to be plastic or thin sheet metal. No wonder stuff doesn't last.


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## Hoodoo Valley (Nov 14, 2006)

Even John Deere is beginning to make certain things in China, all for thye sake of cutting costs. Pretty sad in my opinion.


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## Waldershrek (Nov 23, 2009)

Indeed.....no pride anymore to be built in the USA. It's all about saving a dollar.


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## Blert (Sep 19, 2010)

*Thanks*

Thanks for all the replies. So what I am hearing is for old look at Deere, Cub Cadet, Bolens, Ford, Crafstman. As far as new I actually try not to buy China products as I feel that is the downfall of our economy much more then housing, but thats a different conversation. So as far as new it has to be made in USA, but again the prices get up there. A poll on older Brand/Model preference would be interesting.


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## Waldershrek (Nov 23, 2009)

I'm not familiar enough with the older models to know which ones fit your criteria. I am curious though as those are pretty much my criteria as well.


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## Larry in OK (Jul 22, 2010)

In my experience the older stuff was made to be repaired. The newer stuff is made to be replaced.
Planned obsolesence is a real concern when designing anything these days. They want it to last long enought the customer isn't too PO'd whe he has to buy another one so that he might come back and buy another one of your brand.


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## Bamataco (Apr 22, 2009)

Larry in OK said:


> In my experience the older stuff was made to be repaired. The newer stuff is made to be replaced.
> Planned obsolesence is a real concern when designing anything these days. They want it to last long enought the customer isn't too PO'd whe he has to buy another one so that he might come back and buy another one of your brand.


I think you've got that exactly right. And it doesn't apply to just tractors either.


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## rsmith335 (Jun 2, 2010)

Bamataco said:


> I think you've got that exactly right. And it doesn't apply to just tractors either.


I'm a dumb ole plumber since 1974 and the way homes are plumbed today I wouldn't want a 30 year morgage, mabey 10 to 15, maybe. If I was a first time home buyer, I would look for a 20+ year old home with enough reserve (money) to make energy improvments as long as the main structure is in good shape. I don't have any thing against imergants, but in our area we had plumbing companies working night crews (imegrants) with no experance so they wouldn't get caught and now pepole have 30 year morgages on home that have real problems. Wow BUY OLD


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## fourspeed (May 22, 2010)

I have a 1975 Case 210GT and a 2002 Cub Cadet 1517. I alternate these two tractors on my lawn and cut a neighbors lawn with the Case every week. I wouldn't get rid of either one of them as they are both great machines.


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