# PTO won't disengage



## davidlee

Can anyone help? My 5400 JD PTO won't come out of gear. It happened a few years ago as well and cost about $3000 to repair. Is it a common problem or not repaired properly before?


----------



## sixbales

Howdy davidlee,

That is a good looking tractor! According to tractordata.com, your tractor has an independent PTO, which is a hydraulically actuated clutch pack. One problem with these clutch packs is the discs in the clutch pack get warped from usage, and eventually do not release. 

If you are mechanically inclined, get a shop/service manual and tackle the job yourself. Very rewarding. If not, use a competent local tractor mechanic. JD dealerships charge too much.


----------



## sixbales

One thing which I failed to address in previous post is the possibility of your PTO brake being worn out. An independent PTO will turn when disengaged due to fluid drag. If this is the case, it has no power to rotate, but requires a brake to stop/hold it. The PTO brake is released when the PTO is engaged, but the brake is set when the PTO is disengaged. You can check for this possibility by prying a 2x4 up against the PTO shaft to see if you can stop it from rotating. You will have to tear into the PTO clutch pack to fix the brake if this is the case, and you might as well inspect the discs while you are in there. .


----------



## davidlee

sixbales said:


> One thing which I failed to address in previous post is the possibility of your PTO brake being worn out. An independent PTO will turn when disengaged due to fluid drag. If this is the case, it has no power to rotate, but requires a brake to stop/hold it. The PTO brake is released when the PTO is engaged, but the brake is set when the PTO is disengaged. You can check for this possibility by prying a 2x4 up against the PTO shaft to see if you can stop it from rotating. You will have to tear into the PTO clutch pack to fix the brake if this is the case, and you might as well inspect the discs while you are in there. .


----------



## davidlee

Thanks for your advice. Last week I took it to the JD dealer who couldn't find anything wrong. It was working properly again. They started it up in front of me and it wouldn't disengage and then after stopping and restarting it was working properly again.
Now home again and it is locked on again. It is not the brake as I have checked and with the motor switched off is locked solid. I don't do much PTO work , just running field bins at harvest so doubt if doubt if anything is worn out. If the clutch was warped wouldn't it be on all the time?


----------



## sixbales

Howdy David,

I imagine that the PTO brake is set when the motor is switched off.


----------



## Fedup

I don't believe your tractor has a PTO brake. It does have independent PTO, yes, but it's all mechanical. No clutch pack, no hydraulics involved. It's a two stage engine clutch with mechanical linkage to engage/release the portion that operates the PTO. Your description of the problem thus far is a bit sparse. The control linkage for the PTO is mostly external. (hand lever, pivot joints, rods and clevis pins) Does the engagement lever have the necessary free travel, overcenter tension, etc. that it did when things were working properly? Do the external parts move freely? 
If all that is correct, the problem may well be with the clutch itself and may require a tractor split for repair. On the other hand, the external PTO levers and linkage on many tractors of that series (00, 03, 05, 10) have been changed and improved many times over the course of production with the 00 being the earliest. Your dealer SHOULD be aware of that. There may be some changes or modifications that can be done that may offer some improvement. 
Since the clutch itself is spring released internally, and requires pressure applied to engage the PTO, if you remove the clevis pin connecting the external linkage to the release fork cross shaft entirely, the PTO portion of the clutch should be fully released. At this point you should be able to rotate the output shaft by hand with just a little resistance. If so, the problem is probably external. If NOT, then it's most likely internal.


----------



## davidlee

Fedup said:


> I don't believe your tractor has a PTO brake. It does have independent PTO, yes, but it's all mechanical. No clutch pack, no hydraulics involved. It's a two stage engine clutch with mechanical linkage to engage/release the portion that operates the PTO. Your description of the problem thus far is a bit sparse. The control linkage for the PTO is mostly external. (hand lever, pivot joints, rods and clevis pins) Does the engagement lever have the necessary free travel, overcenter tension, etc. that it did when things were working properly? Do the external parts move freely?
> If all that is correct, the problem may well be with the clutch itself and may require a tractor split for repair. On the other hand, the external PTO levers and linkage on many tractors of that series (00, 03, 05, 10) have been changed and improved many times over the course of production with the 00 being the earliest. Your dealer SHOULD be aware of that. There may be some changes or modifications that can be done that may offer some improvement.
> Since the clutch itself is spring released internally, and requires pressure applied to engage the PTO, if you remove the clevis pin connecting the external linkage to the release fork cross shaft entirely, the PTO portion of the clutch should be fully released. At this point you should be able to rotate the output shaft by hand with just a little resistance. If so, the problem is probably external. If NOT, then it's most likely internal.





Fedup said:


> I don't believe your tractor has a PTO brake. It does have independent PTO, yes, but it's all mechanical. No clutch pack, no hydraulics involved. It's a two stage engine clutch with mechanical linkage to engage/release the portion that operates the PTO. Your description of the problem thus far is a bit sparse. The control linkage for the PTO is mostly external. (hand lever, pivot joints, rods and clevis pins) Does the engagement lever have the necessary free travel, overcenter tension, etc. that it did when things were working properly? Do the external parts move freely?
> If all that is correct, the problem may well be with the clutch itself and may require a tractor split for repair. On the other hand, the external PTO levers and linkage on many tractors of that series (00, 03, 05, 10) have been changed and improved many times over the course of production with the 00 being the earliest. Your dealer SHOULD be aware of that. There may be some changes or modifications that can be done that may offer some improvement.
> Since the clutch itself is spring released internally, and requires pressure applied to engage the PTO, if you remove the clevis pin connecting the external linkage to the release fork cross shaft entirely, the PTO portion of the clutch should be fully released. At this point you should be able to rotate the output shaft by hand with just a little resistance. If so, the problem is probably external. If NOT, then it's most likely internal.





Fedup said:


> I don't believe your tractor has a PTO brake. It does have independent PTO, yes, but it's all mechanical. No clutch pack, no hydraulics involved. It's a two stage engine clutch with mechanical linkage to engage/release the portion that operates the PTO. Your description of the problem thus far is a bit sparse. The control linkage for the PTO is mostly external. (hand lever, pivot joints, rods and clevis pins) Does the engagement lever have the necessary free travel, overcenter tension, etc. that it did when things were working properly? Do the external parts move freely?
> If all that is correct, the problem may well be with the clutch itself and may require a tractor split for repair. On the other hand, the external PTO levers and linkage on many tractors of that series (00, 03, 05, 10) have been changed and improved many times over the course of production with the 00 being the earliest. Your dealer SHOULD be aware of that. There may be some changes or modifications that can be done that may offer some improvement.
> Since the clutch itself is spring released internally, and requires pressure applied to engage the PTO, if you remove the clevis pin connecting the external linkage to the release fork cross shaft entirely, the PTO portion of the clutch should be fully released. At this point you should be able to rotate the output shaft by hand with just a little resistance. If so, the problem is probably external. If NOT, then it's most likely internal.


You are right. It is all mechanical. I have removed the clevis pin and still the pto is fully engaged. Very little movement on the cross shaft. I'm guessing it needs to be split again.
Could it have not been done properly before as it's only done 1000 hrs since the last time?


----------



## Fedup

That's a pretty hard claim to make from out here. The only such issue I've personally witnessed was in a 5303. The incident was definitely operator error, caused by turning too tightly with a PTO driven pull type mower. The action twisted the driveline into pieces, the impact of which actually warped the PTO clutch while it was engaged. The result was there simply wasn't enough room between the flywheel surface and the released pressure plate for the "redesigned" disc to clear. It required a split and a new disc. 
Certainly not claiming that's what happened to yours, but I do question what all was done to yours previously that cost $3000? I've split a couple of those tractors,(all open station, no cabs) replaced the clutch and had them running again in 4 to 4 1/2 hours. Sounds like an awful lot of parts must have been replaced.


----------



## davidlee

Fedup said:


> That's a pretty hard claim to make from out here. The only such issue I've personally witnessed was in a 5303. The incident was definitely operator error, caused by turning too tightly with a PTO driven pull type mower. The action twisted the driveline into pieces, the impact of which actually warped the PTO clutch while it was engaged. The result was there simply wasn't enough room between the flywheel surface and the released pressure plate for the "redesigned" disc to clear. It required a split and a new disc.
> Certainly not claiming that's what happened to yours, but I do question what all was done to yours previously that cost $3000? I've split a couple of those tractors,(all open station, no cabs) replaced the clutch and had them running again in 4 to 4 1/2 hours. Sounds like an awful lot of parts must have been replaced.


Mine is open station with a 540 loader on the front. Looking at the old invoice, the clutch was replaced $1605 (aus dollars) and a bearing $140 and $1130 for labour.
I can't believe the clutch is worn out already.


----------



## Fedup

Well your mention of "a bearing for $140" raises questions. There are three bearings in there that pertain to clutch operation. It doesn't make sense for anyone to replace only one. Maybe that's just a slip in the parts listing/billing process but we don't know that. 
I DO know that a failed pilot bearing can cause the symptom you now have. The PTO disc rides on a shaft which fits into the pilot bearing. If that bearing should seize it can cause said shaft to spin along with the flywheel regardless of clutch interaction. It looks like you will need another split to answer the question.


----------



## davidlee

Fedup said:


> Well your mention of "a bearing for $140" raises questions. There are three bearings in there that pertain to clutch operation. It doesn't make sense for anyone to replace only one. Maybe that's just a slip in the parts listing/billing process but we don't know that.
> I DO know that a failed pilot bearing can cause the symptom you now have. The PTO disc rides on a shaft which fits into the pilot bearing. If that bearing should seize it can cause said shaft to spin along with the flywheel regardless of clutch interaction. It looks like you will need another split to answer the question.


It looks like it. Thanks very much to all of you for your advice.


----------

