# Trouble starting Satoh Beaver 2cyc diesel



## hoople (Apr 3, 2017)

I bought a Satoh Beaver 2cyc diesel tractor last summer from Craig’s list. It ran fine last summer, then I blew a hydraulic line and parked it for the winter. Now that I need to use it again, it won’t start. I’ve read through a lot of threads on this and other forums and have tried a lot of suggestions posted but so far haven’t been able to get it to start so I thought I’d post something of my own with my own specific issues. Maybe someone will have the magic to get me going again.

Here’s what I know what I’ve done and what I’ve tried so far:

While I had the thing in the garage for the hydraulic lines, I went ahead and changed the oil, and replaced the fuel filter since I had no idea about the history of the maintenance on the machine. 

I know that means I need to bleed the fuel lines and I believe I have done that, but can’t be sure (I’ll come back to this).

I’m quite sure the glow plugs are good. They both test ~1.5ohms and I took one out and powered it up with jumper cables and watched it glow red.

It was cranking slow, so I replaced the battery and starter. Cranks much better now.

Now back to the fuel stuff. A lot of forums talk about a hand lever on the injector pump used for bleeding the fuel line but this model doesn’t have a priming hand pump. (this is my pump http://www.southern-global.com/injection-pump) . There’s a bleeder screw on the pump and fuel comes out of that just fine so I believe I’ve got all the air out to that point. Next I cracked the fuel line connection at each of the injectors while turning the engine over and fuel drips out of those. But I have no idea how much should be coming out. I removed the line from the injector entirely and it spurts when I crank the engine, but it doesn’t seem to be much (again, I’ve never seen a known good system so I don’t know what it should look like). I removed the injectors and fuel spurts from those too, but not much. I haven’t measured the fuel per rev or anything though. 

I talked to a diesel mechanic (who is too busy to look at it) but his phone diagnosis pointed to bad rings on a piston (obviously I hope this isn’t the case). 

My neighbor (who has quite a bit of experience with diesel engines) took a look at it tonight and had some good ideas. He was sure that the fuel should be spraying out of the lines when we cracked them open at the injector and the spurts that we were getting was way too little. We pressurized the fuel tank while bleeding at the injectors to try to force any air out of the system, then tightened them up again and cranked with the pressurized fuel tank and the thing came as close to starting as I’ve seen (lots of black smoke). He is convinced it’s a bad injector pump. But dang! $550 bucks! 

I tend to agree with my neighbor, but I’ve also read about folks going to the trouble of replacing the injector pump with no difference in the symptoms. It’s a gamble I know, but at this point I’m out of ideas. Should this be my next step?


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## RC Wells (Dec 26, 2008)

The 2 cylinder 700 cc Mitsubishi diesel used by Satoh can be a bear to bleed the injection lines because they do not always run when just one injector is bled. They also do not self bleed like Yanmar diesels.

The fuel pump lever is good for bleeding the injector pump, but does not deal with the fuel injectors or the lines to those injectors. It is important that level of bleeding is completed before attempting to bleed the injectors.

Bleeding the injection lines is dangerous, and can inject pressurized fuel into a person's skin resulting in death. So be very careful.

Once the filter, the main fuel line and injection pump are bled it will be necessary to loosen one injector feed line at a time just enough they can be barely opened with a wrench one at a time while someone cranks the engine over with the starter. DO NOT OPEN ONE OR THE OTHER WHEN THE STARTER IS NOT CRANKING, OR YOU WILL PUSH A ROPE AND GET NOWHERE.

It is important that the starter not be cycled for more than 30 seconds, then the loose line tightened at the injector before the starter is released and the starter cooled enough that a hand can comfortable be held on the starter without being burned. Repeat the process until fuel sprays under considerable pressure, and the engine may actually start firing on that cylinder. Tighten the spraying line while the starter is still cranking, or you will just allow air to lock the injector once again. This is the dangerous part of the bleeding process, so keep all skin out of the high pressure spray of fuel.

If the tractor starts on one cylinder just leave it running while you then bleed the other injector pressure line. If it does not run on one cylinder, repeat the bleeding process with the other injector pressure line. Once both injectors are bled it will run.

Bleeding the injector pressure lines is done at the injector end of the line. Bleeding at the pump end is a waste if time.

Do not smoke when bleeding high pressure injection lines, the fuel spray is explosive.

Do not use air pressure in the fuel tank, that is done with modern common pressure rail injection systems, but is useless on one of these systems.


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## thepumpguysc (Jan 25, 2015)

Is the engine a "pull cable" shut off?? or w/ the key switch..??
Remove BOTH lines at the injectors at the same time.. Crank the engine.. watch the fuel delivery.. now pull the stop and see if the fuel cuts off.. push it in and do this a couple of times.. & watch the delivery.. my thinking is the pump isn't going into stating position.. & pulling the sh-off cable while the fuel is passing thru will free it up..
I will check your pump for free.. all it will cost you is shipping..back & forth.. heck, send me the injectors too.. send me a msg or put AT AOL dot com after my name..


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## hoople (Apr 3, 2017)

First, thanks for the quick reply. 

Can you detail what you mean by “The fuel pump lever is good for bleeding the injector pump”? Are you talking about pumping the throttle lever? I can see no other lever on the pump. 

I have cracked the injector end of the lines one at a time while cranking the starter and then re-tightened them before letting off on the starter. I’ve done this a couple of times on each cylinder, but still don’t think I’m getting the kind of pressure that could cut skin (not that I’ve tested that of course). How many times should I expect this to take? I’ll keep trying, but I’m being pretty careful not to kill my new starter so it takes time between attempts.

I did notice that the engine speeds up a little and chokes out more black smoke the moment I tighten the each of the fittings, so I guess that tells me that each of the cylinders is firing, just not hard enough I guess.

Also, I’ve never seen fuel coming out of the return line (to the tank). I guess that’s just another symptom of not having the lines bled out properly?

It could be that I’m not getting all the previous steps done right. Like I said, I’ve opened the bleed screw on the pump and get fuel out of that (gravity feed from the tank), but other than that, I don’t know what else to do in order to get the “filter, the main fuel line and the injection pump” bled. Any tips on that?

Thanks for the note about pressurizing the fuel tank. I’ll not bother with that again.


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## RC Wells (Dec 26, 2008)

Some of these are fitted with a primer with a lever that is pumped to bleed all the air out of the lines and filter, and the injection pump. Some are simply gravity feed and will bleed the initial line, filter and pump via the bleed screw.

Sounds like you have the gravity flow type.

Bleed screw is shut, you are bleeding the injector lines and still exhibit low pressure. It is normal for fuel to be returned to the tank via the overflow returns.

Tractor ran fine until storage. 

At this point look for the simplest cause, the fuel shutoff as recommended by thepumpguysc, above. Perform the flow test recommended in that post.

Unless you blew dirt into the pump and injectors during the filter service the problem has to be the injection pump not triggering the operating mode for starting and running.

If the fuel flow does not pick up during the shutoff valve test, then send the pump and injectors in for testing.


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## hoople (Apr 3, 2017)

The tractor does not shut off with the key and it doesn’t have a cable shutoff. There’s a linkage from the throttle lever to a small axel on the pump. When I push the throttle lever to slow the engine, it turns the axel clockwise. When I throttle up it turns counter-clockwise. To shut the engine off, I have to push the throttle lever past the idle position. I’ve never really like that because it feels like you’re over stressing the linkage. That’s how the manual says to do it though. The only other way to shut it off is to idle down and pop the clutch with the brake on.

Here are the results from the throttle experiment. I opened both lines at the injectors, then with the throttle at idle I cranked the engine 30 revolutions and collected thirty spurts for each line. I then moved the lever to full throttle and took more measurements. I collected the fuel in a jar and poured it into a graduated cylinder so they’re not perfect measurements (probably a tiny bit low because of the fuel left in the jar), but here is what I got.

Cyc1 cyc2
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Idle 0.4 0.6
Full 1.0 1.5

Measurements are in milliliters


The tractor ran great last summer and started quickly most of the time. As I recall though, the last couple of times I started It, it did have some trouble so maybe the trouble began before I stored it.

The attached image is of a new pump. You can see where the throttle axel goes with the black bleeder bolt above it. I think the hex head screw and flange are just for packaging? Mine has the axel sticking out of the hole.


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## thepumpguysc (Jan 25, 2015)

You need to have the throttle in Full when starting..
What ever you do.. DO NOT TOUCH that bolt w/ the clamp on it.. under the flange..
Is there an access cover below the inj. pump?? if so, you can remove it & MAKE SURE the throttle is going into the starting position..
My offer still stands.. if you would like to send me the pump & injectors.. I'm here to help..


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## RC Wells (Dec 26, 2008)

If I understand your post, the cap screw that holds the index plate (below and to the right of the bleeder in your photo) is missing. If so, the pump will not be timed properly and is failing to open the fuel valve fully.

That is not a field fix so my recommendation is to send the pump in for setup, testing, and probable repair. Send the injectors along too, good time to get them tested and cleaned.


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## RC Wells (Dec 26, 2008)

If I understand your post, the cap screw that holds the index plate (below and to the right of the bleeder in your photo) is missing. If so, the pump will not be timed properly and is failing to open the fuel valve fully.

That is not a field fix so my recommendation is to send the pump in for setup, testing, and probable repair. Send the injectors along too, good time to get them tested and cleaned.


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## thepumpguysc (Jan 25, 2015)

The "axial" your referring to, is the control rack.. and is on the other side of the pump..
THATS what turns the fuel on & off.. Idle & full, and mid..
The bolt w/ the clamp on it is the equal delivery setting for #2 cylinder..
Notice the pin in the body on #1cyl?? #1 is fixed & the pump shop "sets" #2 to match #1..
The fuel is controlled on the other side..


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## hoople (Apr 3, 2017)

I've decided to go ahead and remove the pump from the engine (this weekend). It's too hard to see what's going on with the cowling and fan guard in the way. I'll likely go ahead and send it to you (thepumpguysc) along with the injectors. 

I just hope all goes well when it comes to re-installing it. I've read something about using shims to set the fuel volume per pulse and pulse timing. The description of this procedure I have on hand isn't spelled out very clearly. Maybe once I get into the engine and see it for myself it will make more sense.


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## thepumpguysc (Jan 25, 2015)

The shims are under the pump mounting flange and are used to set the pump to engine timing.. I HAVE NEVER had to reset the timing on a PFR pump in 35 years.. so I would say your ok.. just put back the originals..


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## hoople (Apr 3, 2017)

So I thought I'd get back to you in case anyone was sitting on pins and needles waiting to hear how this story ended. I sent my injector pump and injectors over to thePumpGuy and, like he promised, he tested them for the cost of shipping. Turns out they were not the problem. And I can’t say enough for the help both on the forum and via e-mail that thePumpGuy had to offer. I find it incredible that there are people like you out there willing to give advice and help to those of us less diesely inclined. THANK YOU! 

Anyway, after learning that the fuel delivery system was okay, I finally went down and bought a pressure tester and sure enough one of the cylinders was not getting the compression it needed. The cost of getting the engine repair done on it pushed me over the top and I went down and replacing the engine, transmission, chassis and everything attached to it. Now I have a brand new tractor and it runs great!


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## thepumpguysc (Jan 25, 2015)

Happy to help but sorry for your engine troubles.. You saved a couple of hundred sending me the fuel system to be checked out.. 
Its a hard pill to swallow when you get a bill for 200.00 & a slap on the back saying, nope, you system is fine..
Sometimes, the best thing to do is, jack up the radiator cap & wheel a new motor underneath it.. lol


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## satstaff (Feb 13, 2021)

thepumpguysc said:


> Is the engine a "pull cable" shut off?? or w/ the key switch..??
> Remove BOTH lines at the injectors at the same time.. Crank the engine.. watch the fuel delivery.. now pull the stop and see if the fuel cuts off.. push it in and do this a couple of times.. & watch the delivery.. my thinking is the pump isn't going into stating position.. & pulling the sh-off cable while the fuel is passing thru will free it up..
> I will check your pump for free.. all it will cost you is shipping..back & forth.. heck, send me the injectors too.. send me a msg or put AT AOL dot com after my name..


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