# Hydro Transaxle?



## wjjones

Does anyone know if a 356-0510 ayp hydro transaxle can be serviced, and if so what type gear oil to use in it?


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## jhngardner367

That unit is servicable. Go to WWW.M&D.com/hydro-gear ,for info.
Hydro gear says to use 79 oz. of 20w50 oil,in them,after draining/servicing.
Their model # is 310-0510,but it's the same unit.


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## wjjones

jhngardner367 said:


> That unit is servicable. Go to WWW.M&D.com/hydro-gear ,for info.
> Hydro gear says to use 79 oz. of 20w50 oil,in them,after draining/servicing.
> Their model # is 310-0510,but it's the same unit.



I wasnt sure my manual says there is no filter, or drain plug but sears parts says it has a filter Part# 173098 and takes 20vv50 oil. Thankyou I will check out the link you gave me...... Its been 6 years, and 325 hrs and I have never serviced it because the manual says it is a non service transaxle??


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## wjjones

I tried the link, and it says Not Found
The requested URL was not found on this server.


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## jhngardner367

Google "ayp transaxle # 356-0510",and that site should pop up.I know it was M-and-D, something/hydro-gear.I'll re-check the site,to make sure.


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## jhngardner367

*reply*

When you see the site come up, DON'T use the 356-0510 #.THEIR # for it,is this : 400506.
The filter p/n,is :70756 ,and the cost is $9.36.


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## wjjones

Ok I got it Thankyou for your help.. Now I need to find out what the fill capacity is..


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## wjjones

Where could I get a manual, or something to show how to perform this service?


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## jhngardner367

Fill capacity is 70oz,of 20w50.The site has downloadable manuals,I believe.


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## txsteve

Keep it in mind that its not a liquid cooled engine..or liquid cooled hydro..So be smarter than the manual and use full synthetic or semi-synthetic 20 w 50 (or the weight its asking for) and use air cooled oil...Motorcycle oil is easy to find..but you'll see on the label Wet Clutch,,Dry Clutch,,Liquid cooled,,Air cooled..
I use Amsoil or Lucas air cooled oil in the small engines..
Just like spark plugs..Champions get thrown away the day I get it and replaced with NGK or Denso Iridium plugs in any gas engine I own..


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## jhngardner367

They don't recommend synthetic in the older units.The 20w50 they told me to use is hydraulic fluid,such as hydro-guard. As for sparkplugs,...you couldn't PAY me to use NGK,Nippon-Denso,or Bosch. I've tried them in several machines,from the motorcycles,to honda& Kawasaki work engines,and they always fouled easier than Champions,or Autolite,or even A/C.
Every Jap bike I've owned,from 90cc Kaw,to my Goldwing,ran better with the CHampions.I just got tired of pushing my 900lb cycle ,due to cheap plugs!


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## wjjones

The manual says 20vv50 can you get that in the synthetic?


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## jhngardner367

Hy-vis,or Hy-guard from John Deere,at $27.50/gal.
OR,you can go to Tractor Supply,etc.
CarQuest/NAPA,may also be able to get it,for you.


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## wjjones

I checked that 400506 transaxle out it was $905.06 at M&D sears is $383, and free shipping. I would like to just service this one though if I can because I am pretty sure that is the problem with it. It hasnt been serviced since I bought it new, and it has 325 hrs on it now.


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## wjjones

I actually looked again with my glasses on this time it is 20w50 oil so you think synthetic would be the best option? How about Castrol synthetic, or coventional 20w50 Castrol, etc?


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## jhngardner367

Just flush it,and clean/replace the filter,and put in the hydro lube.
By the way,I mis-spoke,in my earlier post.I said it takes 70 oz.,but it actually takes 79oz.
If I remember correctly,you can unscrew the vent,and add the fluid ,then put the vent back in.


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## wjjones

Yep I was wondering the filling issue to but it turns out it has a fill plug on the top right side. Do you know if the filter is internal, or external? Thankyou for the fill capacity info I wasnt sure how much to add back.. I almost forgot to mention it does not have a drain plug so I will have to pump it out.


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## jhngardner367

I believe the filter is internal.It's just a screen,so you could just flush it,and refill it. 
You can use synthetic,but if you don't get all the regular hydro out,it may cause problems,depending on how much was still present.
Besides,the Hi-vis is probably cheaper.


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## wjjones

jhngardner367 said:


> I believe the filter is internal.It's just a screen,so you could just flush it,and refill it.
> You can use synthetic,but if you don't get all the regular hydro out,it may cause problems,depending on how much was still present.
> Besides,the Hi-vis is probably cheaper.



I agree I think I will stick with the standard oil synthetic, and conventional doesnt mix well.. I will keep you posted I am going to try to get it done this weekend.. Thankyou for all the input......


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## jhngardner367

Anytime,my friend!


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## wjjones

Well what else could it take other than 20w50 motor oil because I tore it down today, and it smells like gear oil, or hydraulic fluid?


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## jhngardner367

It's NOT 20w50 motor oil! It's20w50 HYDRO OIL! That's why I suggested the Hydro-vis.Sorry if I mis-lead you.


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## wjjones

jhngardner367 said:


> It's NOT 20w50 motor oil! It's20w50 HYDRO OIL! That's why I suggested the Hydro-vis.Sorry if I mis-lead you.



No problem I will check into that Hydro oil...... It will be easy to tell when its full because it is all the way to the plug on top..


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## jhngardner367

OK,my friend.Let us know how it goes.


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## wjjones

5w50 Castrol synthetic should work ??


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## wjjones

I finally changed it today but about 65 ounces is all I could get it to hold? I got 5w50 synthetic motor oil is that ok to use?


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## wjjones

This is from a sears tech. But does it sound right I still want to be sure it uses motor oil, and not hydro oil because I have heard both?

Josh_S, September 03, 2013 

Thank you for the inquiry and for using SearsPartsDirect.com. 

The transaxles use motor oil and we do recommend using 20w50. This fluid works especially well in hotter temperature climates, but is an all around good fluid. This transaxle will use about 76 ounces, but we recommend filling it and measure 1.25" to 1.5" from hole edge to oil. 

If you have any further questions or inquiries, please don't hesitate to ask. Thanks for using SearsPartsDirect.com.


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## Argee

Engine oil has an additive for breaking up and removing carbon deposits from the result of combustion. I have never seen combustion or carbon deposits in any hydraulic system.

From Wiki-Answers:

Additives.

See, both hydraulic and engine oils are made from base oils with additives mixed in. The additives used change the characteristics of the oils so that they function differently. 

Generally, hydraulic oils (final product including additives) are expected to have very low compressibility and very predictable friction and viscosity stability under pressure. 

Generally engine oils (Engine Lubrication Oils anyway) are intended to have high resistance to heat (degradation including chemical and viscosity due to heat) resistence to burning and resistance to absorption of fuels and chemical compounds produced during combustion. 

Both classes of oils are likely to have additives intended to provide detergency and to reduce foaming. 

Base oils are most commonly petroleum oil bases due to cost, but other bases oil can be used including mineral oils (especially for hydraulic oils) and plant oils (especially for engine oils) and oils from animal sources.


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## Argee

Here's an answer from e-How:

"Hydraulic Oil Vs. Crankcase Oil
The fundamental differences between hydraulic and crankcase, or common motor oil, are the varying levels of fluid viscosity. When comparing the temperature of the fluids during use, hydraulic oil produces a lower temperature sensitivity; the viscosity index change corresponds directly with temperature. In crankcase oils, the viscosity changes minimally regardless of the temperature of the oil.

Temperature and Viscosity
When comparing hydraulic oil to crankcase oil, the length of operation is a detrimental factor. The longer a machine -- in this case an engine -- runs, the more friction the oil is expected to disperse. Because of the high viscosity index of crankcase oil, it performs better than hydraulic oil over a longer period of operation."

Clear as mud now isn't it?

The one thing that catches my attention is the consistency of the oil at higher temperatures. I don't think the hydro tranny gets anywhere near as hot as the engine. All that being said...I'd opt for the hydro oil.


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## wjjones

Ok I drained the 5w50 synthetic oil, and put 20w50 castrol synthetic back in it has plenty of pressure, and the whining noise is gone. I had to order a new torque bracket for it because it was cracked around the bolt holes so I will have to pull it out again to install the new one.


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## Argee

That's pretty amazing what a subtle change in viscosity does in a real life application.


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## wjjones

Argee said:


> That's pretty amazing what a subtle change in viscosity does in a real life application.




Yes sir it whined from the day I bought it new with the conventional 20w50 oil in it but its quiet now with the synthetic.


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## wjjones

The bracket kept getting put on back order I ordered it the 5th of October, and they said it would be the 21st before they would get it to send out to me so. I just made my own bracket, and told them to cancel the order.


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