# 20 amp fuse keeps blowing after a few minutes of usage.



## Robert Schoonover

New at this, so bear with me. I have two ride on mowers. I had the 1000 series Cadet.












Everytime I used it. Seemed I had to work on it. Plus it kept eating belts. The engine ran good. But last thing this mower started doing was. After riding and mowing for about a few minutes. It would blow the 20amp fuse. The other mower I have is a Craftsman Mower. This mower I had always liked and I had added all new matching tires and new transaxle and rebuilt the deck and all new OEM belts and at a time. A new 17.5 Briggs and Stratton engine. That engine had thrown a rod since then. So I have a rolling chassis with a blown engine. I didn't try to figure out why the cadet was blowing the 20amp fuse. I had removed the engine from the Cadet and it was pretty much plug and play at putting it in the craftsman. This mower cut really nice, even better than the Cadet. But after about five minutes of usage. The engine shut right down. The 20amp fuse had blown! Looking into trouble shooting for the electrical short. All of what I have found in my searches is the tests you would do for the electrical harness, the key switch, etc. But I don't need to check these. Whatever is shorting it out, a delayed shorting out. Has to be on the engine. I didn't reuse the wiring from the Cadet. I used the wiring that was on the Craftsman.


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## wjjones

Bad voltage regulator.


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## Robert Schoonover

wjjones said:


> Bad voltage regulator.


Is there a way to test it? I went through every wire and connection and inspected and cleaned every connection. Then I disconnected the power lines to the starter relay and one by one started plugging things together and with each connection I turned the key switch and I checked that 20 amp fuse. When I got to the voltage regulator. With the power lead (red) plugged in. The fuse was fine. When I plugged the double lined plugs together, the two black wires coming from the stator into the two yellow wire of the voltage regulator and turned the key switch. The fuse blew. How can I check the voltage regulator and how do I check the stator?


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## Robert Schoonover

Robert Schoonover said:


> Is there a way to test it? I went through every wire and connection and inspected and cleaned every connection. Then I disconnected the power lines to the starter relay and one by one started plugging things together and with each connection I turned the key switch and I checked that 20 amp fuse. When I got to the voltage regulator. With the power lead (red) plugged in. The fuse was fine. When I plugged the double lined plugs together, the two black wires coming from the stator into the two yellow wire of the voltage regulator and turned the key switch. The fuse blew. How can I check the voltage regulator and how do I check the stator?


I found a way to check everything. https://www.vanguardpower.com/conte...a/en_us/Files/FAQs/alternator_replacement.pdf hopefully this link is allowed.


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## Bob Driver

It's not a "regulator".... It's a *RECTIFIER/*regulator. The two black leads from the stator carry *A/C* voltage that pass into the 1/2 wave rectifier and come out as regulated *D/C* voltage.

_Stator Lead test_
1) VOM on Continuity - Neither wire should show continuity to Ground
2) Neither wire should show continuity to each other
3) VOM on A/C Voltage - One lead on each wire, with engine running. Should show a minimum of 28V A/C. At Full throttle, should be 35, or better

_Regulated Lead (red wire)_
1) VOM on D/C Voltage - Test only the red lead... Red lead on red wire -- Black lead to ground. Should show minimum of 13V D/C at idle. No more than 14.5V D/C at full throttle.

Continuity to ground on either stator wire, or continuity between wires.... Stator wiring shorted

Less than 28V A/C output.... Weak Stator

Zero, or less than 13V D/C out on red regulated wire... Bad rectifier/regulator

Everything checks out, but still blowing fuses after red wire is reconnected.... Short in red wire (charging circuit). Bad key switch.


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## Robert Schoonover

I'll give this a try. But what has changed since my last posting is,... the fuse blows when I try to start it now. So I'll only be able to try some of the tests you pointed out.


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## FredM

I would check the Stator as Bob suggests and if this checks out ok then replace the rectifier/regulator, if you didn't change over the ignition switch from the cub then the possibility of the two ignition switches having shorted out is at odds, -- is the cub engine a briggs like the Craftsman?, if it is and engine HP is fairly close, I was going to suggest to change the rectifier/regulator from the blown Craftsman to the Cub engine and try that.


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## Bob Driver

Fred makes a good point.... Ignition switches can look the same, and plug right up, but they're wired differently.

The Craftsman Harness will plug right into the engine harness, but it sounds like it's wired different at the back of the ignition switch plug. 

To get an idea of how many different variations there are to ignition switches
Take a look at this chart and note how many variations there are to just a simple 5-prong switch.

https://www.lawnmowerpros.com/diy/index.php/lawn-mower-ignition-switch-by-terminal/


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## Robert Schoonover

Stator wires, both show continuity to ground and to each other. Stator wiring is shorted. So now I take it that I need a new stator? Where do I get that?


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## Robert Schoonover

https://www.partstree.com/parts/briggs-stratton-696458/ found one, now to see if I can get it at a better price.


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## Bob Driver

$45

https://www.amazon.com/JDLLONG-Alte...&qid=1586828188&sprefix=696458,aps,936&sr=8-2


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## Robert Schoonover

Bob Driver said:


> $45
> 
> https://www.amazon.com/JDLLONG-Alternator-Briggs-Stratton-Craftsman/dp/B07V7FN8PR/ref=sr_1_2?crid=S2XZIWFUR96A&dchild=1&keywords=696458+alternator&qid=1586828188&sprefix=696458,aps,936&sr=8-2


Thanks Bob. But I just purchased one for 50 bucks with free shipping. Plus I dont shop with amazon. Mainly because lately their shipping has been slow and they don't acknowledge using Pay Pal for payment.


Bob Driver said:


> $45
> 
> https://www.amazon.com/JDLLONG-Alternator-Briggs-Stratton-Craftsman/dp/B07V7FN8PR/ref=sr_1_2?crid=S2XZIWFUR96A&dchild=1&keywords=696458+alternator&qid=1586828188&sprefix=696458,aps,936&sr=8-2


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## Bob Driver

Make sure you check out that ignition switch BEFORE you hook up that new stator.

The wrong switch wiring could have been what took out the stator....


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## Robert Schoonover

I'll take a look at it and with the info (link) that shows me the different key switches and make certain which one will work on it. I do have the cadet key switch and it was the same one that was with the engine I swapped over into the Craftsman. But this engine was showing signs of failing when it was on the cadet. It just kept getting progressively worse. Thank you again for sharing your expertise and I will be back in here for when I venture into putting that new stator in.


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## deerhide

I can't help.....maybe buy a sheep to chew your lawn?


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## Robert Schoonover

deerhide said:


> I can't help.....maybe buy a sheep to chew your lawn?


Naaaaaaaaaa,... oh heck did I just say that? lol


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## Robert Schoonover

*Here's an update*. I had found that with this epidemic going on. The vendor for the part I ordered last night. Had alerted me that they had cancelled my order. Because of the unknown hours that may or maynot be kept at their warehouse. So to anyone out there thinking of ordering parts. Keep it in mind that what you order may be cancelled or back ordered. 

*In my case,*... The engine, a 17.5 Briggs and Stratton that threw a rod and has been replaced with the 17.5 Briggs & Stratton that came off my Cadet ride on mower. I'm betting, actually hoping that the blown engine's stator is fine and will or can be the replacement stator that I can use. I'll report back with pictures and model numbers and whatever else I can think of.


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## Bob Driver

Run the continuity test like you just did. If it checks out... Here's a link to my hero (Taryl) that walks you through the job.That particular stator is different from yours, but the video shows you the old school way of pulling the flywheel with just a pry bar and a BFH....


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## Robert Schoonover

Very helpful video. But at the end he was stating about the drain on the battery because of having a PTO. The cadet motor had a PTO hooked up to it. But since I placed it on the Craftsman mower, the craftsman mower never had a PTO, it was manual. So the stator thats in the Cadet motor that is shorted, that is gonna be replaced. Wouldn't the stator from the blown craftsman be an acceptable replacement?


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## Bob Driver

If that stator is good, you'll be fine. The regulator is only going to put as much 12V into the charging system as the battery needs. 

What he was talking about was that particular stator.... Notice it went directly into the charging system and not through a regulator. The main take away from the video was how to pull the flywheel, be careful in routing the wires, and never ever trust Ronnie Jergenson


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## Robert Schoonover

The original stator is the stator of the engine that is blown, this is what I wanted to use as a replacement stator. Problem is. Unlike the engine that I pulled from the Cadet and placed into the craftsman mower. This stator has only one wire coming off of it. The second picture down, the 1st and the 2nd used to be hooked up to each other. The 3rd file is whats on the engine that Im wanting to use. I did a continuity check on the original stator that has one wire and that showed me continuity to ground. Which I believe you all told me would not be any good to use. The engine that I pulled, which is no good, is the same size as the one I got off my Cadet. Both are 17.5 Briggs & Stratton engines. What Im seeing is the rectifiers and the stators are wired different. I did order a new rectifier and should be here this week. The rectifier that is coming is just like in the 3rd picture. But it still looks like Im back to square one. Which is looking for a stator that has two yellow wires coming out of it to a double plug. Only problem with finding the correct stator is the virus thats requiring everyone to stay at home. Warehouses are closed or are moving very very slow at shipments.


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## Bob Driver

OK... Briggs has about 20 different variations to alternators. The picture you just attached is of a 5 or 9 Amp regulated alternator. What you have on the running engine is probably a 20 Amp regulated.....

I'll beg your pardon to modify my last post and now suggest you match the alternator that was on the engine with a replacement. You could use this alternator, but it's probably easier to just order a replacement that is "plug & play" with what you have on the running engine.

Here's a link to a chart that shows all of the different Briggs alternators by engine series and gives current part #'s to help with your search.

https://www.briggsandstratton.com/c...tratton/na/en_us/Files/FAQs/alternator_id.pdf

I also just uploaded a file to the Manuals Section of this forum. Look for "Briggs Engine Wiring"... It will give you detailed information that will help you with this project.


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## Robert Schoonover

By looking at pictures that I have and of the rectifier thats on the mower. The bottom picture of the 3, I posted. Has two yellow wires coming out of it to a double plug and 1 red wire. This link - https://www.vanguardpower.com/conte...a/en_us/Files/FAQs/alternator_replacement.pdf shows a picture of what Im looking at and it says it's • 10 or 16 amp DC regulated for charging battery. • Alternator output is determined by the flywheel alternator magnet size. • 10 and 16 amp system use the same stator, color coding and regulator/rectifier. • Two BLACK leads from stator. • Yellow connector with two pin terminals. • Two yellow leads to regulator/rectifier. • One RED lead from regulator/rectifier to RED connector output lead. The 5 or 9 amp your calling out. I looked at a picture of that and your calling attention to the wrong rectifier picture I put up. The one I'm using or actually replacing is shown in the 3rd picture down of the 3, I posted in the posting before this. Here's the picture of the rectifier that is in my engine that I want to use for mowing.


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## Robert Schoonover

Bob Driver,... after looking at the look up you gave me. The part number I found for the alternator is as follows - 
10, 13 and 16 A DC Regulated
alternator 696458 This what I think I need to order. Just figured I'd better run this by you to be sure. Just so ya know. Ive done my fair share of wrenching too and figured I'd post this picture of what I built in 2010 and still ride to this day. It's not a lawn mower.


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## Bob Driver

OK got it .... The 696458 is superseded by 592830. That's pretty much the standard 10-16A Briggs alternator.


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## FredM

Just signed in again just to have a look at your outfit, very nice and must be a ball terror for touring.


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## Bob Driver

When I was contemplating retiring, to my shock, I didn't have the $1M saved up that T.Rowe Prize says you need to retire "comfortably". The wife says I spent it on tools. Since I wasn't going to be jetting back and forth to Paris, or spending winters in Boca Raton, I figured I was going to need something to keep me busy and put a few fun coupons in the wallet.

I considered working on motorcycles. I was actually a certified Honda mechanic in the late 70's, until I realized you can't really make any money working on bikes.

My specialty is early Goldwings (GL1000/GL1100/GL1200) You know, the ones with 4 carburetors and you have to know what you're doing to make them run right? I had quite a few customers the last few years I lived in Atlanta, because the guys that work in Honda shops today barely know how to take a carburetor apart, much less rebuild and synchronize 4 of them together.

When I moved to MS, the shop decision was between bikes, or lawnmowers. Lawnmowers won, because everybody has a lawnmower, not everybody has a bike. 

Probably the most important factor that tilted the decision against motorcycles is that some of those bikes were inevitably going to be Harleys

Ever ride the "Dragon" (US129) at Deals Gap, NC?


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## Robert Schoonover

Bob Driver said:


> When I was contemplating retiring, to my shock, I didn't have the $1M saved up that T.Rowe Prize says you need to retire "comfortably". The wife says I spent it on tools. Since I wasn't going to be jetting back and forth to Paris, or spending winters in Boca Raton, I figured I was going to need something to keep me busy and put a few fun coupons in the wallet.
> 
> I considered working on motorcycles. I was actually a certified Honda mechanic in the late 70's, until I realized you can't really make any money working on bikes.
> 
> My specialty is early Goldwings (GL1000/GL1100/GL1200) You know, the ones with 4 carburetors and you have to know what you're doing to make them run right? I had quite a few customers the last few years I lived in Atlanta, because the guys that work in Honda shops today barely know how to take a carburetor apart, much less rebuild and synchronize 4 of them together.
> 
> When I moved to MS, the shop decision was between bikes, or lawnmowers. Lawnmowers won, because everybody has a lawnmower, not everybody has a bike.
> 
> Probably the most important factor that tilted the decision against motorcycles is that some of those bikes were inevitably going to be Harleys
> 
> Ever ride the "Dragon" (US129) at Deals Gap, NC?


Actually, since I used to live in NC. I rode all over the Smoky Mountains. Except the dragon. The reason being. On a trike. You steer your ride. On a bike you lean into your turns. For the past 18 years Ive been manufacturing different designs Ive come up with for Harleys and some other types of motorcycles. Nothing for Hondas. Ive nothing against Hondas. They are well thought out. Even my first bike was a Honda. But for the Harleys. I mainly make aftermarket accessory products for their trikes. The trikes are selling very well. Because the main customers for the trikes is us baby boomers. That picture I posted of my trike and trailer. I built all that on my Harley. That what you see there is not a kit. Thats a one of a kind.


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## Bob Driver

Robert Schoonover said:


> Actually, since I used to live in NC. I rode all over the Smoky Mountains. Except the dragon. The reason being. On a trike. You steer your ride. On a bike you lean into your turns. For the past 18 years Ive been manufacturing different designs Ive come up with for Harleys and some other types of motorcycles. Nothing for Hondas. Ive nothing against Hondas. They are well thought out. Even my first bike was a Honda. But for the Harleys. I mainly make aftermarket accessory products for their trikes. The trikes are selling very well. Because the main customers for the trikes is us baby boomers. That picture I posted of my trike and trailer. I built all that on my Harley. That what you see there is not a kit. Thats a one of a kind.


Damn Schoonover.... My Kind of guy. Had the hip replaced last fall and I'm looking to turn my 1977 GL1000 into a trike this fall. I've looked at the "training wheel" kits, but they're pricey and nothing I couldn't do a better job of building myself. Besides, they just look kinda stupid.

Would you be open to private messaging you so I could pick your brain about how to go about building a "real" trike unit from the swing arm back on a shaft drive, maybe even a phone call?

Are you Robert J. Schoonover (6854542)?


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## Robert Schoonover

Bob Driver said:


> Damn Schoonover.... My Kind of guy. Had the hip replaced last fall and I'm looking to turn my 1977 GL1000 into a trike this fall. I've looked at the "training wheel" kits, but they're pricey and nothing I couldn't do a better job of building myself. Besides, they just look kinda stupid.
> 
> Would you be open to private messaging you so I could pick your brain about how to go about building a "real" trike unit from the swing arm back on a shaft drive, maybe even a phone call?
> 
> Are you Robert J. Schoonover (6854542)?


That I am, and yes,... that's my patent number. Private messaging will be fine and in there I'll give ya my phone number. The training wheel riders. They keep calling it a trike. Which it isnt and they are tough on the motorcycle tires for mileage and ya have to be aware of where you stop them on the side of the road. Because the training wheel set-up. Usually keeps the drive wheel from touching the pavement. Also, an expensive necessity is having a raked front end. Without it, it's as comfortable as steering a stubborn half track.


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## Johnboy4600

Wow, what a great in-depth knowledge base! I was going to just suggest grounding issues, but you guys covered that!


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## Michael G Pearson

Robert Schoonover said:


> New at this, so bear with me. I have two ride on mowers. I had the 1000 series Cadet.
> View attachment 55145
> View attachment 55147
> Everytime I used it. Seemed I had to work on it. Plus it kept eating belts. The engine ran good. But last thing this mower started doing was. After riding and mowing for about a few minutes. It would blow the 20amp fuse. The other mower I have is a Craftsman Mower. This mower I had always liked and I had added all new matching tires and new transaxle and rebuilt the deck and all new OEM belts and at a time. A new 17.5 Briggs and Stratton engine. That engine had thrown a rod since then. So I have a rolling chassis with a blown engine. I didn't try to figure out why the cadet was blowing the 20amp fuse. I had removed the engine from the Cadet and it was pretty much plug and play at putting it in the craftsman. This mower cut really nice, even better than the Cadet. But after about five minutes of usage. The engine shut right down. The 20amp fuse had blown! Looking into trouble shooting for the electrical short. All of what I have found in my searches is the tests you would do for the electrical harness, the key switch, etc. But I don't need to check these. Whatever is shorting it out, a delayed shorting out. Has to be on the engine. I didn't reuse the wiring from the Cadet. I used the wiring that was on the Craftsman.


Robert, if your sure it's the engine causing the short, there is probably only 1 source. Under the flywheel is the stator which charges the battery. Two wires come from the stator to a rectifier mounted on the side of the engine. From the rectifier it plugs into a harness. Other than that, the only other electrical is two armatures to generate spark, but that's a different system. If your sure it's the engine, start with the rectifier. Maybe use the one off of the blown engine. Hope it helps.


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## Robert Schoonover

Robert Schoonover said:


> That I am, and yes,... that's my patent number. Private messaging will be fine and in there I'll give ya my phone number. The training wheel riders. They keep calling it a trike. Which it isnt and they are tough on the motorcycle tires for mileage and ya have to be aware of where you stop them on the side of the road. Because the training wheel set-up. Usually keeps the drive wheel from touching the pavement. Also, an expensive necessity is having a raked front end. Without it, it's as comfortable as steering a stubborn half track.


Bob Driver, Im not sure how to do the private messaging in here. So if ya haven't done so. Send me one.


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## pogobill

Robert Schoonover said:


> Bob Driver, Im not sure how to do the private messaging in here. So if ya haven't done so. Send me one.


Hey Robert, just click on whoever's name, Bob Driver for instance, and a screen will come up.... select "start a conversation" and it's like sending a private email.


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## Robert Schoonover

Michael G Pearson said:


> Robert, if your sure it's the engine causing the short, there is probably only 1 source. Under the flywheel is the stator which charges the battery. Two wires come from the stator to a rectifier mounted on the side of the engine. From the rectifier it plugs into a harness. Other than that, the only other electrical is two armatures to generate spark, but that's a different system. If your sure it's the engine, start with the rectifier. Maybe use the one off of the blown engine. Hope it helps.


Michael, I would go that route if what I am doing now wouldn't work. On the other hand. The mower works fine now. Its all fixed! The original stater, you could see that the windings that should all be copper in color. Were fried black. I even replaced the rectifier. Because that didnt pass the continuity check.
















Im glad that I could, with every ones input. That I could fix this mower. I can't believe how much today's prices on lawn mowers are. Thank you to all that have helped me fix my lawn mower.


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