# Wiring on Ford 5000 cluster



## Wolf2c (Dec 16, 2020)

I have all the wires in position besides that black wire. I figured it went on the middle tab?... the temp gauge moves when I turn key on... but if I put that black wire on the center tab I highlighted there, the temp gauge goes down all the way...
also, Is there a tach wire that suppose to screw to the center for the tachometer or is that the black wire?
I need to get a new fuel unit.


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## Wolf2c (Dec 16, 2020)

I’m assuming I’m missing the tach wire all together....


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## Hacke (Feb 22, 2011)

The center tab is a ground connection. Check that the black wire is grounded.
The box with the green wires is a voltage stabilizer that keeps the voltage for the gauges stabilized at ~10 V.
If the cluster is not grounded, the voltage stabilizer is not reducing the voltage, the gauges get 12 V.
If all other wires are connected correctly, the gauges should work after you have connected the black wire, it takes a while for the gauge needles to start moving. You can test a gauge by disconnecting the wire end at a sender, and connect it to good ground.

The gadget on the generator spins the tachometer via a cable.
But first, is the tachometer going clockwise (needle pointing to the right at rest), like this:
http://i.ebayimg.com/images/i/132005533207-0-1/s-l1000.jpg
or counter-clockwise (needle pointing to the left at rest), like this:
http://i.ebayimg.com/00/s/NjAwWDYwMA==/z/9y8AAMXQHU1RxCkF/$(KGrHqN,!okFGpcHnHTHBR)CkFFY-w~~60_35.JPG


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## Wolf2c (Dec 16, 2020)

Hacke said:


> The center tab is a ground connection. Check that the black wire is grounded.
> The box with the green wires is a voltage stabilizer that keeps the voltage for the gauges stabilized at ~10 V.
> If the cluster is not grounded, the voltage stabilizer is not reducing the voltage, the gauges get 12 V.
> If all other wires are connected correctly, the gauges should work after you have connected the black wire, it takes a while for the gauge needles to start moving. You can test a gauge by disconnecting the wire end at a sender, and connect it to good ground.
> ...


Thanks for the advice. I will check into those things


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## Wolf2c (Dec 16, 2020)

Hacke said:


> The center tab is a ground connection. Check that the black wire is grounded.
> The box with the green wires is a voltage stabilizer that keeps the voltage for the gauges stabilized at ~10 V.
> If the cluster is not grounded, the voltage stabilizer is not reducing the voltage, the gauges get 12 V.
> If all other wires are connected correctly, the gauges should work after you have connected the black wire, it takes a while for the gauge needles to start moving. You can test a gauge by disconnecting the wire end at a sender, and connect it to good ground.
> ...


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## Hacke (Feb 22, 2011)

Great, that is the correct one, original cluster looked like this:
https://www.olssonparts.com/globala...jpeg?height=740&watermark=OIEWatermarkMaximum
If they are not plugged, shut the unused bulb openings with some tape, so you do not get dirt or water inside the cluster.

Check the threads and required length for the cable before you order one.


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## Wolf2c (Dec 16, 2020)

I have searched all over for videos and setups that look like mine. Just not finding it. The yellow wire to the far right is going to my brand new fuel sending unit (the factory wire was bad and replaced it with wire I had around) I think I have the B and I wire in right? When I plug in the black wire in my hand to the center, the fuel and temp gauges go all the way over.... the gauges seem to work without that black wire in?!?🤔


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## Hacke (Feb 22, 2011)

Wolf2c said:


> I have searched all over for videos and setups that look like mine. Just not finding it. The yellow wire to the far right is going to my brand new fuel sending unit (the factory wire was bad and replaced it with wire I had around) I think I have the B and I wire in right? When I plug in the black wire in my hand to the center, the fuel and temp gauges go all the way over.... the gauges seem to work without that black wire in?!?🤔
> 
> View attachment 71291
> View attachment 71292












As I wrote before, if the cluster is not grounded, the stabilizer will not work and you get +12V through the gauges. What happens when you connect the black wire is unsure, you have not told what that wire is connected to. However, the needle in the fuel gauge has moved and I suppose the engine is cold, so the temperature gauge should stay at the bottom? So the black wire is probably a ground wire. And again, if you remove the wire from the temp sender and connect that end to ground (engine block), the temp gauge needle should slowly move to highest reading. That is if the wiring from sender to gauge is OK.

Stabilizer test:
The stabilizer works best upright, so position the cluster vertically.
1. Remove the two green wires from "I" at the stabilizer.
2. Connect ground to "Ground tab", if the black wire is connected to ground, use that.
3. Turn on the key switch.
4. Measure the voltage between "I" and ground.
You may need to tap the stabilizer gently with a screwdriver, to get it going.
The correct voltage at "I" is a bit odd to measure with a digital multimeter, the values will change and flicker. If you have an anolog "needle" meter, that should work better.
If the voltage is steady 0 or 12V, the stabilizer is bad.

Gauge test:
The stabilizer works best upright, so position the cluster vertically.
1. Disconnect the wire from fuel sender to gauge and the wire from temp sender to gauge.
2. Connect ground to "Ground tab", if the black wire is connected to ground, use that.
3. Take a jumper wire and connect one end to ground and the other end to the free tab at the fuel gauge.
4. Turn on the key switch.
5. Watch the fuel gauge, the needle should slowly move to full.
6. Turn off the key switch.
7. Connect the jumper wire between ground and the free tab at the temperature gauge.
8. Turn on the key switch.
9. Watch the temperature gauge.

You need to wait a while before a needle start moving.


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## Wolf2c (Dec 16, 2020)

Thank you for these steps!!! Great comment. I will try this and get back. That black wire goes to a junction box you plug in along with most of the wires... I need to look more into that.


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## Paddy5000 (10 mo ago)

Wolf2c said:


> Thank you for these steps!!! Great comment. I will try this and get back. That black wire goes to a junction box you plug in along with most of the wires... I need to look more into that.





Hacke said:


> View attachment 71294
> 
> 
> As I wrote before, if the cluster is not grounded, the stabilizer will not work and you get +12V through the gauges. What happens when you connect the black wire is unsure, you have not told what that wire is connected to. However, the needle in the fuel gauge has moved and I suppose the engine is cold, so the temperature gauge should stay at the bottom? So the black wire is probably a ground wire. And again, if you remove the wire from the temp sender and connect that end to ground (engine block), the temp gauge needle should slowly move to highest reading. That is if the wiring from sender to gauge is OK.
> ...





Hacke said:


> View attachment 71294
> 
> 
> As I wrote before, if the cluster is not grounded, the stabilizer will not work and you get +12V through the gauges. What happens when you connect the black wire is unsure, you have not told what that wire is connected to. However, the needle in the fuel gauge has moved and I suppose the engine is cold, so the temperature gauge should stay at the bottom? So the black wire is probably a ground wire. And again, if you remove the wire from the temp sender and connect that end to ground (engine block), the temp gauge needle should slowly move to highest reading. That is if the wiring from sender to gauge is OK.
> ...



Hi Hacke,

Sorry to jump in on an old thread, but I am having a problem with the temperature gauge on my ford 5000.

When the tractor is started from cold, the gauge is at its lowest point, but after approx 4 or 5 mins engine run time, the hand goes into the red.
When the hand is in the red position, the coolant temperature is only around 50 to 55 degrees Celsius as I've tested it with a thermometer (so it's definitely not overheating as the gauge suggests).
Things I've tried:

new temperature sensor
new wire run from sensor to back of gauge
new thermostat
also tried removing thermostat ( but problem still remains even without thermostat installed)

I've tried testing the gauge and the stabilizer like you suggested in you previous post above. The gauge seems to be working fine when grounded ( hand moves slowly to max temperature position).
The stabilizer voltage reading is fluctuating between 3.5 and 4.5 volts. I've only got a digital multimeter, so hard to tell exactly.

The diesel gauge is working fine with no issues.
I have recently had the engine changed in the tractor, and obviously the coolant was changed also. Would it be possible that there is an air pocket around the temp sensor and therefore giving a false readout?

Any advice would be greatly appreciated, because this problem has me totally puzzled.
Thank you for your time.


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## Hacke (Feb 22, 2011)

Paddy5000 said:


> Hi Hacke,
> 
> Sorry to jump in on an old thread, but I am having a problem with the temperature gauge on my ford 5000.
> 
> ...


Hello there Paddy5000, welcome to the forum!

Since the fuel sender is working fine, I think we can decide that the voltage stabilizer is not a part of the problem.

The temperature gauge is reacting correctly when sender wire is connected to ground. I think we can rule out the gauge. For now.

The temperature sender could be the culprit. However, if I understand things right, you got the same problem with the old and the new sender? Do you have a link to the vendor, showing the sender?

What engine is it in there now? New, rebuilt, a 5000 engine or something else?
Do you have any pictures?

First I would check what temperature there is at the base of the sender with an IR-meter or a thermocouple for the multimeter. If the latter, test it with boiling water first.
Make sure that the radiator cap is in good condition and tightened properly.
Make sure the fan belt is not slipping.
I am not sure what value you should expect, but if the gauge is in red, it should be at least 95º C. If it is that high, the sender could be OK, but there is a coolant circulation problem. A normal value depends on your Thermostat's opening temperature.

If the temperature is significantly lower and the gauge needle is in red, the sender is the problem.


Aftermarket parts are not always of the highest quality and CNHI has mixed up numbers in a way that you cannot find out which one that is the correct one. If you find that the sender is the problem, you could try another one. If you are lucky, it works. Another solution is to add a resistor to the sender wire to tweak it right. But first, make sure what temperature you have at the sender.

Please, do not get offended, did you put in the Thermostat correctly?


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## Paddy5000 (10 mo ago)

Hi Hacke,

Thank you for the quick reply.

I changed the temp sender and replaced it with a new one, and then I went and bout another new one, incase the first one was faulty. So I've tried 2 new temp senders bought from 2 different parts stores and both are very consistent with the (high) readings.

The engine is a rebuild and as far as I know, it's not an original 5000. It's got the new type block. I can add some pictures later.

When the temp gauge hits red, I am getting a temperature read out of 55 to 60 degrees Celsius at the exposed end of the sender plug using an IR thermometer.
The temperature of the coolant in the radiator at the same time is reading around 5 degrees less.

I've also tried 2 new radiator caps, and I have a new fan belt fitted, with no slippage.

The thermostat is fitted correctly, however I even tried running with the thermostat removed, and the problem still persisted.
I'm not offended at all, it's a very good point you make. I've fitted them upside down before and wondered why they were not opening properly.

Again, thank you for your help, it is greatly appreciated.


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## Hacke (Feb 22, 2011)

Does the sender look like this:








TEMPERATURE SWITCH - 1/8 BSP 81784077, 384032249, C4AH10884A, C5NN10884A, D1NN10884A


TEMPERATURE SWITCH - 1/8 BSP




www.emmarkuk.com





or this:








TEMPERATURE SWITCH 3917490, 9712608, 82028131, 83917490, 89712608, D8NN10884AA


3/8 NPT Thread




www.emmarkuk.com


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## Paddy5000 (10 mo ago)

Hacke said:


> Does the sender look like this:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Hi Hacke,

It's the same as the top one. The one with the 1/8 bsp thread.


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## Hacke (Feb 22, 2011)

As far as I know, that is the correct sender for the 5000 cluster.

Cold engine.
Disconnect the wire from the sender.
Connect an ohmmeter between the sender's connector and its base.
Start the engine and watch the meter.

The resistance should slowly decrease as the engine gets warmer.
If the resistance makes a sudden dive, something is wrong with the sender.


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## Paddy5000 (10 mo ago)

Thank you, i will try that today.

Are there any readings I should expect to see at any given temperatures?
I could maybe take the sender out and try it in a cup with water at different temperatures to check if its working. I just can't find any information on what the resistance should be at a given temperature range.


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## Hacke (Feb 22, 2011)

I just thought it is easier to first check how the sender acts in place. If you find it bad, you do not need more tests. And remember that we have not cleared the gauge yet.

I do not know what values you should expect. If you have a variabel resistor or a potentiometer, you could connect that to the gauge and put an ohmmeter over the resistor. Then you adjust the resistor to make the gauge needle stay at the blue zone limit, vertical position and the red zone limit.
Now you have an idea of what to expect from the sender.

I would try the sender outside of the tractor like this:
Remove the sender from the engine.
Connect a wire between the sender and gauge.
Ground the threaded part with a clamp and connect that with a wire to battery (-).
Connect an ohmmeter between the sender's connector and its base.
Put the sender in a pot of water and heat the pot. This would be tricky, because the needle moves slowly, so the temperature needs to be constant for periods.
Measure the water temperature with your IR-meter and see what the cluster gauge does at different temperatures, and how the resistance varies.

If you get a somewhat linear reaction, an inline resistor would do the trick. If the gauge goes fast to red, but the resistance is slowly changing linearly, the gauge has a problem. If the resistance falls down suddenly, causing the gauge to rise to red, the sender is the problem.

If you find that an inline resistor is the cure, put things together on the tractor with the variabel resistor inline with the gauge wire. When the engine is at working temperature, adjust the resistor to make the needle stay vertical. The resistance you read now is the value for an inline resistor.

The setup on these tractors are no precision instruments. I think the important function is that you have a vertical needle at normal working temperature, and that it does something when the temperature goes too high/low.


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